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Old     (DJMattyT)      Join Date: Mar 2015       03-15-2015, 8:18 PM Reply   
Hi guys,
I just left a deposit on a 2014 Scarab HOI jetboat. I know jetboats aren't the best for wakeboarding but this boat fits all my needs great. I am looking into getting a ballast system for it, 3 bag system for a total of 825lbs. My boat holds 1400lbs so with people and gear I really can't go over 800lbs. Do you think this ballast system will be enough to make a difference in the wake? I am looking to get a cleaner not so washed out wake and obviously a little bigger! Also note, all my wakeboarding in the past has been off a 205 Sea Ray Sport with no tower, hoping this will be a bit of an upgrade for boarding.
Old     (Scotty)      Join Date: Apr 2012       03-15-2015, 9:19 PM Reply   
Matt, sounds like the Scarab is a step up from your Sea Ray. It will be interesting to see how the jet drive handles the ballast you are talking about. My experience has been that when weighted, they struggle to get on plane. Put everyone in the nose and you should be fine. Keep your sights set on a V-Drive as an upgrade. The propulsion on these boats is set up to really grab the water and they don't tend to "teeter" between planing and not planing. Have a great summer on the water!
Old     (challengerwake)      Join Date: Mar 2015       03-18-2015, 5:52 AM Reply   
Hey Matt, congrats on the new boat. I also have a jet boat that we use due to our location and all of the skinny water. Scot is right about putting, as much weight in the front as you can to plane. If I'm correct that boat does not have trim. Stock trim it should have a decent wake prob. better than your Searay it is the Seadoo Challenger hull. You will need to play around with the weight, I'm not sure if you will be able to run 800lbs. in that boat. They make 250hp but jet boats in general do not have a lot of torque for pulling.You might want to change the impeller as well. Lastly just my two cents that is a three cylinder Seadoo motor just be aware how much stress that will put on the motor. My jetboat has had the motor rebuild three times.

Last edited by challengerwake; 03-18-2015 at 5:57 AM.
Old     (Redheadd)      Join Date: Apr 2014       03-18-2015, 6:13 AM Reply   
So basically back out of that deal and get at the least a direct drive with a small block.
Old     (DJMattyT)      Join Date: Mar 2015       03-18-2015, 7:12 AM Reply   
Thank you guys, the ballast set up can run 825lbs. My plan was to not fill all the way, im looking to run about 600lbs, I do have the 250hp supercharged engine so I hope it is enough hp and power for wakeboarding. Hopefully I dont have to rebuild it like you said lol what year is your boat?
Old     (Greeko)      Join Date: May 2013       03-18-2015, 10:20 AM Reply   
I guess Red got ignored LOL
Old     (Redheadd)      Join Date: Apr 2014       03-18-2015, 10:39 AM Reply   
Lol he will wish he listened to me when he's doing wheelies through the lake with a washy wake.
Old     (501s)      Join Date: Feb 2010       03-18-2015, 10:56 AM Reply   
IF you plan to do watersports as the primary use of a boat, a jetboat is about the last boat that should be on the list. I am all for people getting out and riding behind whatever is available and having fun but if you want to wakeboard and surf, and are buying a boat for it, a jetboat just isn't a great choice. Any older DD or Vdrive will out perform it and probably hold their value better too over the long term.

Many many users on this site tried Outboards, I/O's and jetboats and once they own a Vdrive they never go back. On the other hand its very rare to go from a DD or Vdrive to an I/O or jet boat unless your needs change.

I had a friend last summer looking for a boat and I recommended an older Bu or maybe a Moomba and they went and dropped $60k on a brand new I/O. After coming out behind our Vdrive they were already talking about selling. I used to have an I/O and I do NOT miss the washy, finky, crappy wake.
Old     (davez71)      Join Date: Oct 2007       03-18-2015, 11:44 AM Reply   
Also the bad thing about jetboats is that they really don't have a neutral. this is key when teaching young kids to ride and when picking riders up. I'm with 501s, instead of spending money on a jet boat put that into a new or used inboard.
Old     (denverd1)      Join Date: May 2004       03-18-2015, 12:04 PM Reply   
huh?
Old     (DJMattyT)      Join Date: Mar 2015       03-18-2015, 12:14 PM Reply   
I didnt mean to ignore Reds comment. It came up a lot smaller than the other comments and I guess I replied before seeing it. Just want to throw it out there that the tides where I am located drastically get low, being able to come in with 12inches of water makes the difference on somedays whethere I can go out or not. I'm also sure all of you guys are A LOT better wakeboarders than I am. I just have fun out there, my friends and I all ride but none of us are pros
Old     (challengerwake)      Join Date: Mar 2015       03-18-2015, 8:21 PM Reply   
Matt im in the same boat as you with the tides. We have some great water but it can be tricky to get to. And as others have said v-drives and dd are best but you need to purchase what works for the water your in and they do not work well in shallow water. I have an older seadoo with the 2stroke and yes some may say that's like comparing apples to oranges but its still the same concept. Just wanted to give my two cents and as long as you are having fun that's what matters. Most of us on here aren't pros and don't really need $80,000 v-drives.
Old     (philwsailz)      Join Date: Feb 2009       03-20-2015, 11:43 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by davez71 View Post
Also the bad thing about jetboats is that they really don't have a neutral. this is key when teaching young kids to ride and when picking riders up. I'm with 501s, instead of spending money on a jet boat put that into a new or used inboard.
Having owned jets, I can tell you that with this type of jet, while it is not a true neutral per se, (where the thing is literally not pumping) there IS a way to slow, go into reverse, and sit still with the motor running. These things will hover if you will, with the motor at idle you can apply a very small amount of forward or reverse, just by slightly moving the reversing bail control... The throttle is separate from the reversing bail control so you can throw the bail control from full forward to full reverse, and anywhere in-between without going out of idle.

I have never been a more precise driver picking up, docking, etc. than when I was driving my jet. With twin motors, you could maneuver the thing like in a balet, hover, inch forward, inch backward, inch sideways, spin inside your own boat length. It is like flying an RC helicopter, sort of...

The two things I personally don't like with jets is lack of trim control, (you in-board and v-drive owners don't have it either) and the fact that they steer backwards in reverse when compared to a car or more traditoonal boats. In a car, with the wheel turned to the right, the back of your car goes to the right. In a jet though, when you turn the steering wheel right when backing, the back of the boat goes left. It is a very weird feeling.... It is way more pronounced than the prop-walk many of you experience.

Phil
Kicker

Last edited by philwsailz; 03-20-2015 at 11:46 AM.
Old     (WakeDirt)      Join Date: Jun 2011       03-20-2015, 9:40 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJMattyT View Post
I didnt mean to ignore Reds comment. It came up a lot smaller than the other comments and I guess I replied before seeing it. Just want to throw it out there that the tides where I am located drastically get low, being able to come in with 12inches of water makes the difference on somedays whethere I can go out or not. I'm also sure all of you guys are A LOT better wakeboarders than I am. I just have fun out there, my friends and I all ride but none of us are pros
You were off to such a good start...try and ignore all of Red's comments.
Old     (ryansgt)      Join Date: Aug 2006       03-21-2015, 10:57 PM Reply   
I don't think I would be taking even the jet boat in one foot of water. There are v drives out there for far less than 80k and while we may not need to sack out boats with 5k in extra ballast because we aren't pro, I would much rather have a well formed unweighted vdrive than a ballasted jet boat and I have riden both. The other thing is you will never ever be able to surf that jet. Even if you could get that much extra weight in the jet, you wouldn't be able to hold speed. Yeah you can count me in the camp that thinks if your number one goal is sports, you should be in a quality vdrive. You could easily get into a mid 2000's vlx or MC for the low 30's and have enough left over to buy a tow vehicle and find a body of water that you would better suit you and pay for gas for the next few years. Your next step may be to demo both so you can actually see the differences.
Old     (DJMattyT)      Join Date: Mar 2015       03-22-2015, 9:35 AM Reply   
Ryan, the wake boats in my price range have WAY too many hours for my liking to be honest. Im not looking for a boat with 450+ hours on it. If I had the extra cash, I would buy a wake boat no questions asked.
Old     (volzalum)      Join Date: May 2009       03-22-2015, 10:26 AM Reply   
If the boat has been maintained well, I'd take a 1000-1500 hour vdrive before id get a jet boat. The marine inboards are able to go well over 2000 hours before rebuild.
Old     (ryansgt)      Join Date: Aug 2006       03-22-2015, 12:20 PM Reply   
I concur Dax. That amount of hours means noting if it was used and maintained. I sold my 05 VLX for 35k last year and it had about 450 on it. That is an average of about 45 hours a year. That is nothing. Buying a club boat with 2k on it, that is a different story. I would just say demo the boats before you commit. Maybe jet will be good enough for what you want but 60k is an awfully big leap to take without knowing. Just trying to advocate caution.
Old     (ottog1979)      Join Date: Apr 2007       03-22-2015, 1:45 PM Reply   
^ 3X Dax. I bought my '02 V210 with 455 hours on it and in super-clean shape. It's now approaching 1,000 hours, still in great shape and running strong. Because it's paid for and cost me only what I put into it in gas, maintenance, insurance and registration, I have no future plans to replace it.
Old     (challengerwake)      Join Date: Mar 2015       03-22-2015, 1:54 PM Reply   
Guys I think everyone is missing the point. I agree with everyone about inboards (either dds or v-drives) you cant beat them. I grew up with a mailbu and sac it out over 1000lbs whenever I go home. But he is going to be running in a saltwater environment with tides. I had no clue about running boats in this environment till I moved to the coast. Ski boats with fixed running gear are not good in this enviroment. I agree that he could buy a good used v-drive but its not the best boat for the water he will be running in. And yes anything below 1000 hours is not bad. 350s and 351s that are in ski boats hardly turn 4000rpms (my parents malibu turns between 2200 and 3000 @ 22mph depending on load) and will run forever if properly maintained.
Old     (ryansgt)      Join Date: Aug 2006       03-22-2015, 9:10 PM Reply   
As far as saltwater goes, that will wreak havok on any boat you have in there if it uses the body of water as it's source for cooling water. Using closed loop would solve the problem for either the jet or the inboard. There are millions on inboards running in salt in all sizes. We did get that with tides coming in and out there may be certain areas that are much shallower when the tide is out. There is no misunderstanding, except that there is a fundamental conflict in usages here. We are on a wakeboarding site with someone asking opinions on what they should get while also saying it has to be able to function in a foot of water. Quite frankly the conflict is such that something has to give. You either want a boat for wakeboarding or you want a boat that will be able to function with a very shallow draft. It's like saying you are thinking about picking up a jon boat for your lake that has a 25hp limit, will it work for wakeboarding. Yes, we have all seen the videos of byerly throwing down behind a hand tiller but will it do it the way you want, most likely not. So, if wakeboarding is the primary goal, you know what you have to do. If your primary concern is location, and you really must ride in that area, then be prepared to accept a less than ideal setup for boarding. It will be washy, it will struggle to hold speed with just about any amount of weight, it will be unable to surf, but it will pull you and be able to run in a shallow draft at your chosen location. No confusion here. Only thing that needs to be clarified is his emphasis. I would be afraid that he thinks that this jet boat is going to be an upgrade from an io when at best it is going to simply be equal. Paying 60k to have a boat the throws the same washy wake as the io I just got rid of would surely piss me off.
Old     (DJMattyT)      Join Date: Mar 2015       03-23-2015, 5:04 AM Reply   
Ryan, you hit it right on the head. Just two things, the I/O was my brothers boat not mine and If I was spending 60K on a boat, this article would not be here and I would be in a MC or Malibu. I go for a sea trial this week on the Scarab, I guess I will see how it looks and if its as terrible as people here say it is I am probably going to back out of the deal.
Old     (ryansgt)      Join Date: Aug 2006       03-24-2015, 11:14 PM Reply   
As I look back i'm not sure where the 60k number came from. What is the full price on the scarab? I see 42msrp though that is usually the unloaded one they advertise.
Old     (DJMattyT)      Join Date: Mar 2015       03-25-2015, 6:05 AM Reply   
The one I am looking at is a '14 leftover just about every option for 36K
Old     (williamburell)      Join Date: Sep 2011       03-25-2015, 6:57 AM Reply   
Quote:
The one I am looking at is a '14 leftover just about every option for 36K
I paid around that for a 07 x2 with 120 hours.......I'd looking at other options.
Old     (DJMattyT)      Join Date: Mar 2015       03-25-2015, 8:37 AM Reply   
William, thats pretty awesome man! I wish I could find something like that
Old     (phathom)      Join Date: Jun 2013       03-25-2015, 9:58 AM Reply   
I just wanted to throw these options out there for you.
If you don't like how the jetboat performs, or if you just wanted to go to a V-Drive all together. There are these two boats in your area for less than you'd be paying for the new Scarab. The Mastercraft looks pretty solid and has been recently serviced.
2003 X30, $30k
http://newjersey.craigslist.org/boa/4937632475.html
2005 VLX $34k
http://newyork.craigslist.org/fct/boa/4938506394.html
Old     (DJMattyT)      Join Date: Mar 2015       03-25-2015, 10:35 AM Reply   
Thank you man I appreciate that! I have to stay under 21 feet and 8feet in beam for the boat to fit in my slip. Unless I was able to work something out with the town (town marina) but pretty much it has to be 18-21 foot and 8 beam or less
Old     (williamburell)      Join Date: Sep 2011       03-25-2015, 11:04 AM Reply   
x1 has a 90" beam

Been for sale for awhile. Good price. Needs a skin or 2
https://www.onlyinboards.com/2006-Ma...xas-47970.aspx

Super low hour 08
https://www.onlyinboards.com/2008-Ma...ona-44963.aspx
Old     (phathom)      Join Date: Jun 2013       03-25-2015, 2:40 PM Reply   
I gotcha. That VLX is just a tad too big. 8'2" beam and 21'6".
Kind of a downer with size restrictions, but those X1s fit the size and budget requirements.

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