TRUMP for Prez

Pretty clear no matter how you spin it. If there were no Republicans at the wheel, the vote would have gone down in a sea of nays.

never said equally

isn't it clear that without the over 50% of dem senate, it wouldn't have passed

I don't even blame Congress for giving Bush the authorization after he so effectively sold it to the American public and allies. I'm just playing your game and pointing out that if only Democrats were voting it wouldn't have passed. The egregious mistake that Republicans made was that after the fact they acted as though Bush was a great President, and refused to acknowledge the consequences of his huge blunder. I still see people posting memes about how they wished they had Bush back. Republicans discredit themselves every time they open their mouth.

my point is: and it's not a complete though and wouldn't win against a well seasoned debate team.....but they are my beliefs and like yours, not easily swayed

the left wants to not accept blame for anything. In fact, they want to place blame on everyone (as a group) on the right

the right hates women.....really? I think my feelings were summed up in someones post earlier. Obama supports countries that hate women.
the right is racist.......really? I don't see an issue with a wall or fence. I don't see a negative about regulating who and how many become new citizens. But, the current "leader" and his wife are well documented racists. Seems like the pot calling the kettle white

right spends tons of money on war. But yet, it's been over 8 years and we are still spending and still involved. Those fingers never get pointed

Left wants campaign reform. It wants big biz to not be able to influence. But, hollywood is a free microphone. Soros has his fingers in everything. This is never mentioned

Make fun of Trumps hair or his wife because she's pretty......but can't say anything about Oblummer or his wife.

I really don't get the double standard. I know that some of yalls minds can't be changed and you won't even acknowledge the hypocrisy

the examples are endless

ok. I will play
Yes, in hind sight, the war was a mistake.
We should have let them deal with their own trash.

But still, I would rather have Bush than Oblummer.

now, you get to admit to some of Obama's blunders

????

America has been sucking on Saudi butthole for a long time. To try and make a case that Obama or Hillary being friendly with them is something new is total BS. This is my main point. Republicans complaining about the same s**t that's been going on forever only because a democrat is in charge. Why would we want ignorant people who have no sense of history in charge?

There are liberals who are complaining about Obama engaging in military actions in the ME. Killing lots of innocents with drones and making mistakes. Mistakes not because Obama is President. But mistakes because it's impossible to engage in war like actions without killing innocent people. We don't equate living in America with living in a ME s**thole. Only republicans do that. If we torture detainees the republicans justify it by saying... well look what happens to Americans/Women/Xtians in the ME. No s**t Sherlock. We aren't the ME. We don't aspire to be like them. And we don't justify who we are by saying look at them.

Now let me get this straight... I don't really recall anyone making fun of Laura Bush. Then the Republicans come along and totally disrespect the First Lady. Now when Democrats make fun of Trump they are hypocrites? This makes it abundantly clear why when Republicans mocked the BLM movement that they are clueless that the response was to ramp up the situation with non-pc narrative and then the crazies start shooting. Republicans are literally too stupid to understand the consequences of their own actions.

Originally Posted by ord27

ok. I will play
Yes, in hind sight, the war was a mistake.
We should have let them deal with their own trash.

But still, I would rather have Bush than Oblummer.

now, you get to admit to some of Obama's blunders

????

Well from a Republican perspective Obama's flaw is that he didn't invade the wrong country, waste trillions, kill thousands of soldiers, hundreds of thousands of innocent foreigners, and just generally destabilize a significant and dangerous part of the world.

From a liberals perspective Obama's flaw is that he continues to support removing dictators once Bush got the ball rolling.

To bring what has happened in the PAST in regards to the war to whats is relevant today.

Hillary Voted for the war. FACT:
Trump Was against the war. FACT:

So you want to Argue that Bush got us in a war that was wrong (and i agree with you) and you want to blame him for our wo's of today on the war in Iraq, BUT you want to elect a woman who voted for the war in Iraq & vote against a Man who was against the war.???? Yes cliff you hit the Nail right on the head. The kettle callling the pot white!

Cliff try to Remember, The Left always play the VICTIM. Good luck on them EVER taking responsibility for any blame.

Originally Posted by grant_west

Trump Was against the war. FACT:

https://soundcloud.com/buzzfeedandre...n-sept-11-2002

Go to 3:40. He even thought that Saddam should have been removed in Desert Storm.

Originally Posted by ord27

the left wants to not accept blame for anything. In fact, they want to place blame on everyone (as a group) on the right

I'm not disagreeing with you but this is really a draw isn't it? I mean is there a great example of "the right" owning a blunder and saying "boy were we wrong about that"?

Originally Posted by ord27

the right hates women.....really? I think my feelings were summed up in someones post earlier. Obama supports countries that hate women.

which ones? Are these countries that we haven't had strategic alliances with in the past?

Originally Posted by ord27

the right is racist.......really? I don't see an issue with a wall or fence. I don't see a negative about regulating who and how many become new citizens. But, the current "leader" and his wife are well documented racists. Seems like the pot calling the kettle white

The problem is really with the definition of racism. That debate is way to nuanced for this thread, but essentially it boils down to the difference between prejudice and racism. Sure, subjugated minorities can have prejudices against other groups. But racism is acting on those prejudices to keep the subjugated group down. So the group on the bottom may be prejudiced, but cannot really ever be racist.

Originally Posted by ord27

right spends tons of money on war. But yet, it's been over 8 years and we are still spending and still involved. Those fingers never get pointed

I think they get pointed a lot.

Originally Posted by ord27

Left wants campaign reform. It wants big biz to not be able to influence. But, hollywood is a free microphone. Soros has his fingers in everything. This is never mentioned

Have you not heard about the billions of dollars of free TV time that a certain reality TV star managed to get this political season?

Make fun of Trumps hair or his wife because she's pretty......but can't say anything about Oblummer or his wife.

You've never seen a political cartoon of Obama with oversized extra big ears?

I really don't get the double standard. I know that some of yalls minds can't be changed and you won't even acknowledge the hypocrisy

IMHO both sides are VERY guilty of phony outrage at perceived slights. Shakespeare wrote Much Ado About Nothing over 400 years ago. Nothing new here.

What is this "victim" BS? What kind of victim talk is going on here? How do I seem to be depicting myself as a victim by noting how f**k'n stupid conservatives are? It's like fish in a barrel mocking you as you shoot them. I guess they know they are toast so figure they'll down in a fit of moronic defiance. LOL

Let me just say I get Cliff. He's a small business owner and the biggest concern in his life is minimum wage, health insurance, and business regulation. He figures that he'll suffer the least over those issues with Republicans in charge. I personally don't think employment and HI should have any connections whatsoever. And if we had universal HC then business owners wouldn't be bearing the brunt of this misguided approach to HC.

I must admit that I do occasionally enjoy these exchanges. I wish, at times, that I were better at articulating my points.

I appreciate that John. Yes, those are my concerns

Shawn, you and Jeremy have both made the phony outrage or fake anger comment. It actually has me thinking about what's important. Perhaps I will mellow a bit on some political issues. Not concede, just mellow. I might just prioritize my anger, or decide if I have any room for any level of anger in my life anymore.
Thanks (not sarcasm)

If I can sell more pizzas and keep Uncle/Aunt Sam from taking my profits, maybe I will upgrade to a new Malibu VLX

Originally Posted by ord27

I must admit that I do occasionally enjoy these exchanges. I wish, at times, that I were better at articulating my points.

I appreciate that John. Yes, those are my concerns

Shawn, you and Jeremy have both made the phony outrage or fake anger comment. It actually has me thinking about what's important. Perhaps I will mellow a bit on some political issues. Not concede, just mellow. I might just prioritize my anger, or decide if I have any room for any level of anger in my life anymore.
Thanks (not sarcasm)

Cliff, likewise. This has actually turned into a decent place to get opposing views and to talk through stuff. For the most part we have managed to keep name calling to a minimum. I've gotta say that my thoughts on guns/gun control have really matured through some of these discussions.

On the phony outrage thing -- for instance, whether Mrs. T plagiarized or was just real unlucky about her word choice.... it really isn't a big deal, and we'll all have forgotten about it 6 months from now. It's pretty funny today though!

THE HOWARD STERN SHOW! LOL That's a good one! Keep them coming.

https://soundcloud.com/buzzfeedandre...n-sept-11-2002
Go to 3:40. He even thought that Saddam should have been removed in Desert Storm.

Trump Timeline

Sept. 11, 2002: Howard Stern asks Trump if he supports invading Iraq. Trump answers hesitantly. “Yeah, I guess so. You know, I wish it was, I wish the first time it was done correctly.”

Jan. 28, 2003: Trump appears on Fox Business’ “Your World with Neil Cavuto,” on the night of President Bush’s State of the Union address. Trump says he expects to hear “a lot of talk about Iraq and the problems,” and the economy. He urges Bush to make a decision on Iraq. “Either you attack or you don’t attack,” he says. But he offers no opinion on what Bush should do.

Ok here is the final nail in your Libral coffin on this argument

Bottom Line HILLARY . That's YOUR Horse in this race for prez cast her VOTE for the war!
TRUMP "a guest on the Howard Stern Show" AKA FART MAN says over the phone says "“Yeah, I guess so"

sorry LibraTards in My book a "VOTE" Overshadows a conversation with a comedy DJ over the Raido.

Grant that's a lot of words. Fact is, at best, he was "for it before he was against it," right? Hmmm, that'd be a good tag line for a commercial....

And the hits keep coming. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/...b0fa896c3fca7e




Antonio Sabato Jr., featured as a prime-time speaker Monday night at the Republican National Convention, said President Barack Obama is “absolutely” a Muslim.

Speaking to ABC News after his convention speech, the actor and former underwear model claimed “we had a Muslim president for seven and a half years.”




“I don’t believe the guy is a Christian,” Sabato said. “I don’t believe the guy follows the God that I love and the Jesus that I love. If you follow his story, if you understand about Obama, I mean, that’s not a Christian name, is it?”

When ABC’s Amna Nawaz noted that Obama attends church regularly, Sabato continued to assert that he is not a Christian.

“I have met a lot of Christians, know a lot of Christians. I am one, and I don’t believe he is,” Sabato continued. “I believe that he’s on the other side.”

Asked to elaborate, Sabato said that he meant “the Middle East, the bad side.”

“We had a Muslim president for seven and a half years,” he said.

Really? Seems like the final nail should of been that a Republican President was responsible for selling the war to the public and a large numbers of republicans are still fawning over Bush.

I certainly understand why you wouldn't take Trump at his word. Not sure how his own words would be discredited by the the fact he said it on Howard Stern. But yeah, I'll buy the fact that Trump's words mean little. So basically we have Trump saying he was against the war from the beginning, but he can't provide a single bit of evidence to support that. So you claim that it's a fact even though the only evidence at all WRT Trump's opinion on the war was him recorded saying he is for it. He supported it with reluctance. But if you ever go look at Hillary's comments on going to war she clearly claimed it was fraught with danger.

Obama a MUSLIM Lol wow that's a good one More Comedy, How in the world could anyone EVER get that Idea????
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=XKGdkqfBICw

^^^^^^LOL^^^^^^ We are getting off subject. I would way take 4 more years of Barry over the Hilda Beast

I'm with you there, Ram.

Originally Posted by TheWakeIsReal

So you're fine with her assuming the role of arm candy? And you wonder where my statement came from.

I am fine with what ever she wants to do with her life. What I am hearing is that in your eyes, she can not simply be "arm candy". Why can she not have a choice. You anti choice?

Originally Posted by pesos

Speechwriting book, you crack me up Rod. Why can't people just admit this is plagiarism? The best part is that the plagiarized text is extolling the virtue of HARD WORK lol. If Obama pulled this 8 years ago she would have been crucified. Hilarious that people get their panties in a bunch because the first lady tries to help fatass Americans eat healthier.

Better go out and do some checking. Michelle, Barrack, and Hillary have been accused of plagiarism in the last few years. The difference is, she is the wife of a candidate that has nothing to do with running a country. The rest are trying to be part of the political process.

Originally Posted by fly135

Yeah, we definitely don't want anyone in the WH that might try to teach kids to eat healthy. And definitely not someone who would want them to have healthcare.

We want someone with Republican morals. You know.... the kind of morals that praise an ex president that invaded the wrong country, wasted trillions, and needlessly killed 5000 Americans. The kind of morals that when a Democrat is elected President their top man in Congress vows to bring America down to make sure that Democrat isn't elected again. You know true patriots! And we know they are true patriots because they wrap themselves in the flag while doing it.

Hey John. Again, you lie. Democrats voted for it. Democrats spoke openly about going after Saddam and taking him out. The democrats had power of the purse for 6 years under Bush and did not pull the plug.

What are we doing in Afgahnistan? Hasn't Obama been president for a few years now? What is so important there? We knew within a few days that Bin Laden was not in that country yet we are still there. Why is that?

Originally Posted by fly135

I don't even blame Congress for giving Bush the authorization after he so effectively sold it to the American public and allies. I'm just playing your game and pointing out that if only Democrats were voting it wouldn't have passed. The egregious mistake that Republicans made was that after the fact they acted as though Bush was a great President, and refused to acknowledge the consequences of his huge blunder. I still see people posting memes about how they wished they had Bush back. Republicans discredit themselves every time they open their mouth.

He sold it to the public? Funny the democrats have their own investigation arm and are in all the committees They had the same intel and told the same stories. What you are saying is, the democrats either were liars/ they did not have a backbone/ or were negligent.

Originally Posted by pesos

Ron, my kids start school next year. And again, are you somehow trying to blame the First Lady's push for people to get off their butts for a law passed 100-0 in the senate?

Oh well. Then let her make speeches. She also has a law degree and decided to be political. Good for her, however I don't need her.

Originally Posted by fly135

Promoting a narrative the Democrats and Republicans were equally responsible for voting for war should be accompanied by some facts. Although I'd argue that there was only one Republican that's to blame (3 actually), and he was not in Congress.

Looks like Senate dems voted for it and a good number of House dems voted for it.

They had power of the purse for 6 years and added the presidency after that and still did not end the war. Why are we in Afghanistan?

http://www.cnn.com/2016/07/19/politi...ns-plagiarism/

Vice President Joe Biden, 1987: During the 1988 Presidential election, the then-presidential candidate was accused of mimicking a speech that British Labour Party Neil Kinnock delivered just four months prior.
Kinnock's speech included the following lines:
Why am I the first Kinnock in a thousand generations to be able to get to university? [Pointing to his wife in the audience:] Why is Glenys the first woman in her family in a thousand generations to be able to get to university? Was it because all our predecessors were thick?
While Biden said:
I started thinking as I was coming over here, why is it that Joe Biden is the first in his family ever to go to a university? [Pointing to his wife in the audience:] Why is it that my wife who is sitting out there in the audience is the first in her family to ever go to college? Is it because our fathers and mothers were not bright? Is it because I'm the first Biden in a thousand generations to get a college and a graduate degree that I was smarter than the rest?
The vice president was forced to withdraw from the presidential race after Maureen Dowd of the New York Times exposed his plagiarized speech. Allegations followed that Biden lifted parts of other speeches from Hubert Humphrey, Robert Kennedy, and JFK.

BONUS. Barack Obama, 2008. Hillary Clinton 2008 campaign spokesman Howard Wolfson said President Barack Obama had "lifted rhetoric" from Massachusetts Gov. Deval Patrick.
"If your whole candidacy is about words, then they should be your own words," then-Sen. Clinton said about Obama at the time. "That's what I think."
Obama admitted that he used some of Deval's words at a Jefferson-Jackson dinner in Wisconsin.
"Deval and I do trade ideas all the time, and you know he's occasionally used lines of mine," Obama said.
"I would add I've noticed on occasion Sen. Clinton has used words of mine as well," Obama added. "As I said before, I really don't think this is too big of a deal."

http://www.breitbart.com/big-governm...rack-michelle/

Michelle Obama Copied Alinsky in Speech Melania Trump Allegedly Plagiarized

http://heavy.com/news/2016/07/melani...deval-patrick/

Barack Obama Was Accused of Lifting Words From Governor Deval Patrick

Biden Was Accused of Plagiarizing a Speech by Welsh Labour Leader Neil Kinnock

Originally Posted by deltahoosier

http://www.breitbart.com/big-governm...rack-michelle/

Michelle Obama Copied Alinsky in Speech Melania Trump Allegedly Plagiarized

Good god you need to read stuff before posting. Comparing Michelle's portion of a sentence from an entire Alinksy book to what the TRUMP TRAIN 2016 just did is ridiculous. Do you even know what part of Michelle's speech took from Alinsky's book? Doubt it.

Originally Posted by TheWakeIsReal

Good god you need to read stuff before posting. Comparing Michelle's portion of a sentence from an entire Alinksy book to what the TRUMP TRAIN 2016 just did is ridiculous. Do you even know what part of Michelle's speech took from Alinsky's book? Doubt it.

It is spelled out where it is from. Point is, every one of these people have been accused of this. I really don't care to be honest, but this feigned outrage that a non politician did this (intentional or unintentional) is silly.

Originally Posted by deltahoosier

It is spelled out where it is from. Point is, every one of these people have been accused of this. I really don't care to be honest, but this feigned outrage that a non politician did this (intentional or unintentional) is silly.

If you don't care then why bother to google things such as this? Point is, no. Not every one of these people has done this.

Originally Posted by deltahoosier

I am fine with what ever she wants to do with her life. What I am hearing is that in your eyes, she can not simply be "arm candy". Why can she not have a choice. You anti choice?

Well played, touche'

Delta Played you guys so good! And his link proves you all wrong about the Plagiarism
http://heavy.com/news/2016/07/melani...deval-patrick/
The chickens have come home to roost

lol, heavy.com. hard hitting journalism like Tiffany Trump's Top 10 Best Instagram Photos... http://heavy.com/entertainment/2016/...kids-children/

seems like an unassailable source!

I was not complaining about giving free lunches. No one should a problem with that. The problem with the food program is it limits what kids can eat--low calorie foods, no seconds--and kids are going home hungry and food that could be redistributed is thrown away. The program is a joke and just because it passed the senate does not mean it's an effective measure. If you don't believe me, ask some teachers and low-income parents. Some of the reasons Americans are obese may be they cannot afford low-fat food, vegetables, and it's not safe to let kids play outside, not because the school cafeteria is serving pizza.

Ron, I don't think anyone said anything about how effective the program was. Folks were trying to somehow blame Michelle Obama for something the senate unanimously passed, when she has zero power to vote on or pass anything - that was the context being responded to.

Hey J-rod, didn't you used to work for TurnItIn.com ? They ran Melania's speech through their college plagiarism checker and it came as nearly half rip-off:

http://mashable.com/2016/07/19/melan...k#g0QjfZiAjqqE

Originally Posted by grant_west

Delta Played you guys so good! And his link proves you all wrong about the Plagiarism
http://heavy.com/news/2016/07/melani...deval-patrick/
The chickens have come home to roost

LOL, you don't get it. Who cares about the speech. The making a big deal about it is political strategy. It's all about the game. This distraction is intended to reduce the usual boost that a candidate gets from the convention, and throw out more confusion over the Trump candidacy.

I'm not sure what was funnier yesterday, the memes and jokes about Melania's speech from the left or the justification for it from the right! I saw some funny stuff on the news and on FB. I think the best one was "it doesn't matter if she copied it because she is hot and Michelle is not". WTF?!?!?!

I see the other articles on Obama, Biden and others who have plagiarized and yes, they are wrong too and they took their heat for sure. One FB friend was in an absolute outrage at the left and couldn't believe that they thought it was a rip off. Do you know what would happen in the music industry if someone's song lyrics were that close to another song? LAWSUIT! Do you know what would happen if another politician used something of Donald Trumps that closely? LAWSUIT!

I think the best one was "it doesn't matter if she copied it because she is hot and Michelle is not". WTF?!?!?!

...said every Sarah Palin voter.

Originally Posted by bigdtx

...said every Sarah Palin voter.

The GOP base is too distracted by a female that is attractive to them.

Trump aide comes forward to apologize for the plagiarism.

"In working with Melania Trump on her recent First Lady speech, we discussed many people who inspired her and messages she wanted to share with the American people. A person she has always liked is Michelle Obama. Over the phone, she read me some passages from Mrs. Obama’s speech as examples."

OMG Cliff!!! Melanie Trump expressed sincere admiration for a KNOWN RACIST!!!!! Clearly you can't trust the Trump's judgment.

Originally Posted by pesos

Trump aide comes forward to apologize for the plagiarism.

"In working with Melania Trump on her recent First Lady speech, we discussed many people who inspired her and messages she wanted to share with the American people. A person she has always liked is Michelle Obama. Over the phone, she read me some passages from Mrs. Obama’s speech as examples."

OMG Cliff!!! Melanie Trump expressed sincere admiration for a KNOWN RACIST!!!!! Clearly you can't trust the Trump's judgment.

So much for the "it wasn't plagiarism" argument.

The whole episode, though quite minor in the big scheme of things, does seem to be indicative of Mr. T's semi-incompetent lean-n-mean operation.

Originally Posted by timmyb

The GOP base is too distracted by a female that is attractive to them.

You ever see the meme of Democrat women vs Republican Women. Let's just say that the democrat women are tore up.....

Originally Posted by shawndoggy

So much for the "it wasn't plagiarism" argument.

The whole episode, though quite minor in the big scheme of things, does seem to be indicative of Mr. T's semi-incompetent lean-n-mean operation.

Trumps wife is not a politician or a lawyer like Obama or Clinton. She does not know of peer review and so on. However Obama and Clinton and Biden do. They all did it but it is the house wife who gets beat up for this? I can see it now. More of the democrats war on women........

Originally Posted by pesos

Trump aide comes forward to apologize for the plagiarism.

"In working with Melania Trump on her recent First Lady speech, we discussed many people who inspired her and messages she wanted to share with the American people. A person she has always liked is Michelle Obama. Over the phone, she read me some passages from Mrs. Obama’s speech as examples."

OMG Cliff!!! Melanie Trump expressed sincere admiration for a KNOWN RACIST!!!!! Clearly you can't trust the Trump's judgment.

At least a democrat finally admits that Obama is a racist. Finally some healing can begin....

Originally Posted by deltahoosier

More of the democrats war on women........

Yeah, keep working that angle. LOL

LOL, Trump advisor advocating assassination.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politi...Kz&ocid=ASUDHP

""She is a disgrace for the lies that she told those mothers about their children that got killed over there in Benghazi," Baldasaro said."

Turns out that only one of the mothers is claiming that. The others claimed that no talk of video was made.

Originally Posted by deltahoosier

Trumps wife is not a politician or a lawyer like Obama or Clinton. She does not know of peer review and so on. However Obama and Clinton and Biden do. They all did it but it is the house wife who gets beat up for this? I can see it now. More of the democrats war on women........

So it's ok for you the conservative to freak out when the left says you guys might have a problem keeping woman down? Should I have a freak out about that last sentence?

And just so you know l, there was backlash about the lifted statements. Especially Biden's. Biden had previously always given reference. The guy who Obama lifted parts from disagreed with the allegations and Obama said they shared views. It's not really the same. But keep trying, especially after you said you don't care about the speech thing? Yet continue to google articles on it.

Man these things get so blown out of proportion. Here's the writer's take on what happened. http://www.marketwatch.com/story/mel...ism-2016-07-20

Originally Posted by deltahoosier

Trumps wife is not a politician or a lawyer like Obama or Clinton. She does not know of peer review and so on. However Obama and Clinton and Biden do. They all did it but it is the house wife who gets beat up for this? I can see it now. More of the democrats war on women........

So you think DJT was like "surprise me" with the speech? That the campaign was not responsible for vetting content? You make it seem like "oh she's just unsophisticated and not wise in the ways of the world," but c'mon man she had a speechwriter! The same longtime trump associate who ghostwrote some of DJT's books. This is a campaign goof much more than a Malania goof.

Originally Posted by TheWakeIsReal

So it's ok for you the conservative to freak out when the left says you guys might have a problem keeping woman down? Should I have a freak out about that last sentence?.

Freak out away. It is your right. It is a play on the democrats always saying Republican war on women. Funny. I am fairly socially middle of the road, however I also understand cause and effect.

And just so you know l, there was backlash about the lifted statements. Especially Biden's. Biden had previously always given reference. The guy who Obama lifted parts from disagreed with the allegations and Obama said they shared views. It's not really the same. But keep trying, especially after you said you don't care about the speech thing? Yet continue to google articles on it

There obviously was backlash. So be it. They are people who are lawyers and it matters to people like that. It does not matter to a housewife who does not do peer reviewed work like the professional lawyers. Until this came up, I am not sure any of us knew of any of this. Too much talk about nothing of consequence at this point. Why are we not talking about the fact we are still at war in Afghanistan or the over 2000 shootings in Chicago this year so far? I figured that would be important to democrats considering democrats are rioting and shooting cops because they matter.

Originally Posted by shawndoggy

So you think DJT was like "surprise me" with the speech? That the campaign was not responsible for vetting content? You make it seem like "oh she's just unsophisticated and not wise in the ways of the world," but c'mon man she had a speechwriter! The same longtime trump associate who ghostwrote some of DJT's books. This is a campaign goof much more than a Malania goof.

So what. It is not a whole conceptual speech that she took word for word. I just pointed to Obama and Biden doing the exact same thing. They were actually the candidates that they did it. Where was the outrage for that? Me, I don't really care because I think the words they say are Bull S@#t anyway so I don't care what they say.

I think she got a speechwriter who let this get too close. I think it says something about Trump that he allows his people to learn from a mistake (if you want to call it a mistake). If you fired everyone who did not do a perfect job, there would not be anymore employees.

Originally Posted by deltahoosier

So what. It is not a whole conceptual speech that she took word for word. I just pointed to Obama and Biden doing the exact same thing. They were actually the candidates that they did it. Where was the outrage for that?

Originally Posted by deltahoosier

There obviously was backlash. So be it.

?

Funny thing on all this that you guys are not even realizing. Not a single person started a Hillary for President thread. Most of the discussion does actually revolve around Trump for most of the conversations. People spend their time trying to talk down Trump instead of talking up Hillary. That tells me that he is in everyone's head. Hillary is not defendable on so many levels that people really don't even try. Trump was not my guy but this tells me he is winning....

Originally Posted by TheWakeIsReal

?

Outrage on this board.

There was backlash on Biden since his response to the question got his campaign killed off.

Originally Posted by deltahoosier

Funny thing on all this that you guys are not even realizing. Not a single person started a Hillary for President thread. Most of the discussion does actually revolve around Trump for most of the conversations. People spend their time trying to talk down Trump instead of talking up Hillary. That tells me that he is in everyone's head. Hillary is not defendable on so many levels that people really don't even try. Trump was not my guy but this tells me he is winning....

You don't honestly believe he is going to win in November, do you? I think Trump ultimately sunk his campaign by selecting Pence as his running mate. He needed to appeal more to the middle of the road voters not the die-hard conservatives.

Originally Posted by deltahoosier

People spend their time trying to talk down Trump instead of talking up Hillary.

Talk up Hillary! Now that would take some doing. Hillary is part of the machine and represents the status quo more or less. Yes she is as slippery as an eel and likely to line her own pockets handsomely but she is unlikely to do anything too stupid like start a war with China or bankrupt the economy with some protectionist nonsense. Sometimes when you have the choice between a distasteful known or a terrifying unknown the distasteful is palatable.

Originally Posted by deltahoosier

Funny thing on all this that you guys are not even realizing. Not a single person started a Hillary for President thread. Most of the discussion does actually revolve around Trump for most of the conversations. People spend their time trying to talk down Trump instead of talking up Hillary. That tells me that he is in everyone's head. Hillary is not defendable on so many levels that people really don't even try. Trump was not my guy but this tells me he is winning....

Delta, I think you are looking at it wrong. Have you ever seen that compilation video of rope swing fails where all the fat people fall off the rope before they hit the water? Any thought on why those vids get like 10M x more views than the rope swing success videos?

People like watching a trainwreck, and the Donald is definitely that.

"When asked what he hoped people would take away from the convention, Mr. Trump said, “The fact that I’m very well liked.”"

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/07/21...mp-issues.html

apparently this is what it looks like when you expect an endorsement from Cruz and he instead tells the delegates to vote their conscience:

Originally Posted by wake77

You don't honestly believe he is going to win in November, do you? I think Trump ultimately sunk his campaign by selecting Pence as his running mate. He needed to appeal more to the middle of the road voters not the die-hard conservatives.

I truly believe that anyone has a shot at this point. I have never heard of Pence prior to his VP selection but I think Trump choose Pence to unify the party, so we will see if that works.

Cruz was doing what he did last night because he was trying to set himself up for 2020, but in fact he sank his own ship. Trump knew he wasn't getting an endorsement which is why he walked out and everyone put their backs to Cruz.

The middle of the road voters are just that, middle of the road. One day they are all about Trump and the next day the aren't, so why not appeal to your base in addition to the others that have been brought into the party through the primaries?

After seeing everything that is going on in the world and the way Obummer is handling it, Trump has a very good shot of winning. Obama continues to create divide in the US and people are slowly getting sick of it. We have a president that is quick to condemn law enforcement when they are trying to subdue a career criminal and felon with a firearm who is resisting arrest.

Why do you think he has changed his tune a little lately? The liberals know that he is killing them with all that rhetoric and it plays into Trumps hands. As sad as it is, the more this BLM crap continues, cops being targeted, and ISIS attack, the more people realize that Trump is a good choice because Hillary will be 4 more years of Obama and that isn't working.

Someone posted something on Facebook yesterday.

When you get a chance, go look at each of the Candidates FB page and see how many of your friends like each. You will be very surprised the results.

Originally Posted by davez71

Someone posted something on Facebook yesterday.

When you get a chance, go look at each of the Candidates FB page and see how many of your friends like each. You will be very surprised the results.

I bet Pokemon Go has them both beat.

Originally Posted by davez71

Cruz was doing what he did last night because he was trying to set himself up for 2020, but in fact he sank his own ship. Trump knew he wasn't getting an endorsement which is why he walked out and everyone put their backs to Cruz.

Dave, let's remember that it was only about three months ago that Trump accused Cruz of cheating on his wife, basically called Cruz's wife ugly, and insinuated that Cruz's dad was complicit in the Kennedy assassination. I think Cruz is a self absorbed egomaniac, but I can understand why he might be in the NeverTrump camp.

The middle of the road voters are just that, middle of the road. One day they are all about Trump and the next day the aren't, so why not appeal to your base in addition to the others that have been brought into the party through the primaries?

demographics. The base is too small and it shrinks everyday.

Why do you think he has changed his tune a little lately? The liberals know that he is killing them with all that rhetoric and it plays into Trumps hands. As sad as it is, the more this BLM crap continues, cops being targeted, and ISIS attack, the more people realize that Trump is a good choice because Hillary will be 4 more years of Obama and that isn't working.

PLEASE read that NYT interview I linked last night. It's an interview he gave YESTERDAY. If you think it shows he's moderating his message, please point me to which part of the interview is backing down from a prior more aggressive position. I'd say he's doubling down, but that phrase has really lost its meaning in this cycle.

Originally Posted by davez71

Someone posted something on Facebook yesterday.

When you get a chance, go look at each of the Candidates FB page and see how many of your friends like each. You will be very surprised the results.

Ha Ha... It's 20-1 Trump over Clinton in my realm of the world.

Originally Posted by shawndoggy

Dave, let's remember that it was only about three months ago that Trump accused Cruz of cheating on his wife, basically called Cruz's wife ugly, and insinuated that Cruz's dad was complicit in the Kennedy assassination.

And the publicity of Trump sexual harassment is just starting to hit the fan. Looks like they are getting the worst parts of Bill Clinton without the best parts.

Originally Posted by sppeders

Ha Ha... It's 20-1 Trump over Clinton in my realm of the world.

was the ratio tighter in any of the last three elections (Bush/Kerry, Obama/McCain, Obama/Romney)?

Originally Posted by shawndoggy

PLEASE read that NYT interview I linked last night. It's an interview he gave YESTERDAY. If you think it shows he's moderating his message, please point me to which part of the interview is backing down from a prior more aggressive position. I'd say he's doubling down, but that phrase has really lost its meaning in this cycle.

I was referring to Obamas message that he is creating this divide more and more each day.

Originally Posted by davez71

I was referring to Obamas message that he is creating this divide more and more each day.

That's what the superficial thinkers say anyway.

Originally Posted by davez71

I truly believe that anyone has a shot at this point. I have never heard of Pence prior to his VP selection but I think Trump choose Pence to unify the party, so we will see if that works.

Cruz was doing what he did last night because he was trying to set himself up for 2020, but in fact he sank his own ship. Trump knew he wasn't getting an endorsement which is why he walked out and everyone put their backs to Cruz.

The middle of the road voters are just that, middle of the road. One day they are all about Trump and the next day the aren't, so why not appeal to your base in addition to the others that have been brought into the party through the primaries?

After seeing everything that is going on in the world and the way Obummer is handling it, Trump has a very good shot of winning. Obama continues to create divide in the US and people are slowly getting sick of it. We have a president that is quick to condemn law enforcement when they are trying to subdue a career criminal and felon with a firearm who is resisting arrest.

Why do you think he has changed his tune a little lately? The liberals know that he is killing them with all that rhetoric and it plays into Trumps hands. As sad as it is, the more this BLM crap continues, cops being targeted, and ISIS attack, the more people realize that Trump is a good choice because Hillary will be 4 more years of Obama and that isn't working.

Didn't Cruz simply do what has been the tagline for the Trump campaign: Go against the status quo/establishment? So now we should attack Cruz for simply following one of Trump's campaign bullet points? Sounds like hypocrisy to me...

Originally Posted by fly135

That's what the superficial thinkers say anyway.

No the superficial thinkers believe that this is all created by Trump. They think he is a racist and a bigot without any CREDIBLE facts

I have yet to see any thing that points to this.

Yet the liberals, think if someone says deport illegal immigrants or build a wall, they are racist.
If you want to keep refuges from coming here because ISIS has infiltrated them, your a (insert name).
Questioning Muslim's, is intolerant and racial.

I cant speak for you however, based on past post I'm sure I know the answer, but I'm sick of the terrorist attacks, the illegals, and all this racial BS.

Illegals come to the US, don't pay taxes, qualify for Welfare/Medicaid, and go to our school while we pay for them. Of course the liberals bring them in with open arms because that's more voters for them. Look what they did in Virginia with the prisoners.....

Its sickening that we think this is okay. I'm more than fine with someone applying for a work visa, applying for citizenship, learning our language and paying taxes. However, that isn't happening. Our public schools, where my wife is a teacher, caters to those that cant speak English. She has to have a translator sit in on meetings with parents.

But in the world today, we want to give them amnesty and bring everyone to the US at the tax payers expense. That makes sense.....

Originally Posted by wake77

Didn't Cruz simply do what has been the tagline for the Trump campaign: Go against the status quo/establishment? So now we should attack Cruz for simply following one of Trump's campaign bullet points? Sounds like hypocrisy to me...

I'm not saying that he didn't do that. But what I am saying is that he should suck it up and support Trump. He lost fair and square. I was a Cruz supporter and think that he could really help Trump in many ways. I just expected a little bit more from him last night.

^^^^ great points^^^^^

And when it come time to vote who do you think these immagrants are going to vote for?
The Libs love transplant voters.
You think any gun toating thugs Votes republican? Same Go's for our soon to be Refugees? When the times comes for them to vote they are gonna vote dem.

Originally Posted by davez71

No the superficial thinkers believe that this is all created by Trump. They think he is a racist and a bigot without any CREDIBLE facts.

Yeah, who are they going to believe? Trump or their lying ears. LOL

Originally Posted by grant_west

^^^^ great points^^^^^

And when it come time to vote who do you think these immagrants are going to vote for?
The Libs love transplant voters.
You think any gun toating thugs Votes republican? Same Go's for our soon to be Refugees? When the times comes for them to vote they are gonna vote dem.

Also, with all these influx of workers, the low paying jobs are being taken. Its hard to have higher wages when people are willing to come here and do it at lower cost. This whole thing about being worked to hard is crazy. The younger generation does not understand hard work. I can tell you how many times a week I get a complaint that my workers say they are over worked and need help.

As a small business, we will have to cut jobs if wages are raised based on current taxes and etc.

Originally Posted by davez71

Illegals come to the US, don't pay taxes, qualify for Welfare/Medicaid, and go to our school while we pay for them.

I can understand the idea that people paid in cash don't pay income taxes, but how do they get around gas taxes, property taxes (baked into rent even if they don't own), sales tax, etc.?

I'm ignorant about this, but it was my understanding that lots of illegal immigrants with faked papers do in fact pay taxes, medicare, social security, etc. but don't file tax returns or draw on the phony SSNs for social security. Is that not the case? Is it possible to get a tax refund or draw on social security using forged papers?

Originally Posted by davez71

Yet the liberals, think if someone says deport illegal immigrants or build a wall, they are racist.
If you want to keep refuges from coming here because ISIS has infiltrated them, your a (insert name).
Questioning Muslim's, is intolerant and racial.

I cant speak for you however, based on past post I'm sure I know the answer, but I'm sick of the terrorist attacks, the illegals, and all this racial BS.

.

You do realize that almost none of these terrorist attacks have been done by refugees right? In every country including the European ones they have been citizens and most were born in that country. I'm fine if you want to question people, but at least get the party correct when you're questioning.

Originally Posted by TheWakeIsReal

You do realize that almost none of these terrorist attacks have been done by refugees right? In every country including the European ones they have been citizens and most were born in that country. I'm fine if you want to question people, but at least get the party correct when you're questioning.

The attackers in Brussels were refugees, You do realize that?

NYT, a news agency many on here cite, wrote an article that ISIS were disguising as Syrian refugees to get into certain countries., but I guess we should ignore that.


What party should we question?

Originally Posted by shawndoggy

I can understand the idea that people paid in cash don't pay income taxes, but how do they get around gas taxes, property taxes (baked into rent even if they don't own), sales tax, etc.?

I'm ignorant about this, but it was my understanding that lots of illegal immigrants with faked papers do in fact pay taxes, medicare, social security, etc. but don't file tax returns or draw on the phony SSNs for social security. Is that not the case? Is it possible to get a tax refund or draw on social security using forged papers?

You're 100% right. And no they don't get their tax refund nor social security.

http://money.cnn.com/2014/11/20/news...gration-myths/


DEPORT THEM! BUILD THE WALL!

Originally Posted by TheWakeIsReal

You do realize that almost none of these terrorist attacks have been done by refugees right? In every country including the European ones they have been citizens and most were born in that country. I'm fine if you want to question people, but at least get the party correct when you're questioning.

Depends if you call massive gang killings by illegals terrorism or not?

Originally Posted by TheWakeIsReal

You're 100% right. And no they don't get their tax refund nor social security.

http://money.cnn.com/2014/11/20/news...gration-myths/


DEPORT THEM! BUILD THE WALL!

They also sent money directly out of the local economies by the tune of $40 billion a year if I recall from the last time I checked. It continuously runs from 3rd to the 4th leading GNP item for the Mexican government.