Correct Craft wins JD Powers Award again...

What happened to Mastercraft this year?? Last year they tied with Correct Craft for first place.

JD Powers

The overall score...

Wow really impressive, JD powers what an honor

i think nauti pays JD to be on the top, their is no way they beat MC

I wannt to know if jd powers buys the boats off the lot or do they get "special boats" delivered by the manufacturer?

This is an online or phone survey of actual customers. Its not JDs opinion. I was contacted online for the last car I bought by them.

Good stuff.
It is interesting that only 2, MC and Natique, are above average. Everyone else is below average.

To set the average that high, JD Powers must have had a lot more people with MC and Natiques surveyed.

I guess that would make sense when you factor in market share.

Does this info make a difference to anyone??

IE - will anyone change their purchasing decision based on this info??
IE - Was going to buy Malibu, but decided to buy MC or Natique based on the JD Power survey??

No and I don't believe these things are apples to apples. Much like the boat buying guide in wakeboarding magazine. I own an MC. Thats not to say CC is crap by any stretch. Just not sure that the JD power thing is truly objective. Either way good for CC

I really don't think much of these surveys.

"their is no way they beat MC"

Really? Please explain...

When you buy a new boat JD Powers sends you the form to fill out. I got one when I bought my CC and when my father-in-law bought us the Malibu. It's up to you to mail it back in. They send the same form to every new boat owner so it is "Apples to Apples".

It think it is very funny that everyone says JD Powers is rigged, but when Mastercraft tied CC last year it was a big deal. When they come in second for the umpteenth time it's a scam and can't be fair...

Yeah seriously.... If this is based on customer support it may not be but I am a little confused, than MC should be last, copes blew abosuly you know what and MC just didnt give a shiet about all the problems we had.

The Rating Factors




(Message edited by wakeboardsam on February 16, 2009)

those all look pretty accurate except I'll give MC a better helm/instrument panel.

malibu sure sucked it up.

I spent the last 1 1/2 years looking for a new wake boat. I have probably been the biggest pain in the A$$ for the dealers in my area. But when you are talking 50 to 80k I do my homework. All the top boats are well built but when you take time to really look and test its no surprise to me Nautique won again.
They are virtually flawless in design and workmanship. MC is very close in quality but I think they are overpriced and only a 3 year warranty. As for me I had my choice of any brand and I went with Nautique.

^^^^^
Twitch...you are correct in a way. What the results don't show directly is actually implied thru the numbers....overall, quality and reliability, and engine are influenced by both the builder and the dealer.

I may get flamed for this, but after almost 20 years in the business, I truly believe it:

Correct Craft tends to have an overall better dealer network, in terms of quality, than the other builders. This is further supported by regional distributers who can assist local dealers with problem boats and customers. This creates the feeling that the boat itself is of higher quality, because CC's will typically be better prepped and any initial issues will be better resolved by these quality dealers.

Granted, this is a broad based statement, and I know there are exceptions to every rule. But you rarely hear of a large volume CC dealer who routinely pisses off their customer base, as both MC and Malibu have experienced, particularly in the West Coast market. And since the West Coast market represents a pretty sizeable chunk of the total volume for these builders, 1 bad "mega dealer" can skew the survey numbers pretty drastically.

SO, how do they choose the list

IOW - why isn't MB or Sanger, or Chapparelle (sorry, couldn't resist) on the list?

(i am going to shoot myself for putting Chapparelle in the same sentence as mb and sanger now)

They send out surveys to those buyers who bought from companies that have the capability of returning a large enough number of questionares.....If memory serves me, they need a minimum of 400 returns to run the numbers. (based on info that I had from at least 3 years ago)MB, Sanger, etc just don't retail enough units to fit into their model. Chap is not an inboard builder, but I believe you will find them rated in the I/O catagory.

It is a bought award for marketing. woohoo.

I never got a JD power survey for my 'bu.

^^^ You MF'er how could you? I'm guessing they pay to be included in the surveys.

I never received a JD Power survey from the two Malibu's I have purchased.

They need to send em out a year or two after one purchases the boat otherwise it's more of a how was your buying experience type survey.

This award shouldn't have anything to do with the boat dealers (i.e. Copes).


Malibu 3 stars at watersports.... no way.

Malibu 2 stars for engine? Indmar is a very good engine and other MFGers use Indmar. Pretty sure Moomba uses Indmar and they got three stars. This whole award seems strange.

It is all about ad spend....Just like Car and Driver

MC, BU, Moomba, and Supra all use Indmar so why is the engine category all over the place? It's because it's all B.S.

Tige and CC use PCM so why are they spread so far.

(Message edited by 05mobiuslsv on February 16, 2009)

as mentioned above, it is based on customer feelings. lots use Indmar, so logically they should all have the same, but becuase of bad experiences with dealers the perceived value/performance is dropped. who really knows, who cares. All in all congrats to CC. Regardless of affiliation (I'm a MC guy) I think it speaks volumes for the overall quality of your product if you are continually winning/ranking high on the list.

This is part of an e-mail I sent to JD Powers.

"Thank you for the quick response but I question the results without data available. Your site states Wakeboard / Waterski

("The 2009 Boat Competitive Information Study is based on responses from 9,790 owners who registered a new boat between June 2007 and May 2008. The study was fielded from September to November 2008". )

This does not tell me how many responses Mastercraft had relative to Correct Craft. Common sense tells you the most disgruntled customers will be the ones to respond in larger numbers vs very happy customers. Consumers want to know the ratios and by only making them available for the marine market segment makes me believe you are hiding something from consumers or you just had not thought of that aspect.

I encourage you to publish these numbers for credibility on JD Powers part.")

Dealers are the key for the builders. The dealers hide a lot of problems by doing their job and going through the boat before the consumer takes delivery.

I do not understand why these ratios and builder numbers are so private but IMO it's just another award because someone said so.

Mark

"Dealers are the key for the builders. The dealers hide a lot of problems by doing their job and going through the boat before the consumer takes delivery."

I agree, with the exception of the word "hide".
Good dealers "correct" issues before delivery, and good builders pay them to do so.

Same argument every year.... Go back and do a search....

"they pay to get the award"

"I didn't get a survey"

"same power plants, different scores"

bla...bla...bla....

JD Power is a self report by owners, nothing more and nothing less. Maybe Correct Craft owners have the thickest ownership glasses. Or Correct Craft makes sure owners that do get a JD Power survey are tracked down and informed that whatever we need to do to make sure you get us a 5 star rating, let us know and we will do it.

I don't know and I don't care....Christ people are petty.... I don't need a *****in survey from JD Power that says I am #1 to make me feel good about my purchase or the boat I won....nor do I need to knock the survey or the company that wins.....

Anyway, congratulations to Correct Craft for winning the award again.

P.S. For full disclosure, I own a 2003 SAN....

Mark Q - Welcome to this board what you asked JD interesting.

I've bought two new Correct Crafts and haven't filled out a JD Power survey yet. I think I just might fill it out on my 2009 210 I have on order. I've had nothing but great experiences with my CC boats and my dealer is top notch.

I've had very few issues but when I needed something replaced on warranty it happens so fast it is unbelievable. For example, with my 2007 210. I had the gel coat on my platform crack a little. CC sent me a brand new one no questions asked. I had a slight seam tear on one of my swing up rear seats. CC sent me brand new complete seats for both sides just in case the other one had the same issue.

The customer service with my local dealer for a customer is second to none.

Congrats to CC for another win. They sure deserve it.

I find it VERY hard to believe that Supra is that low. When you look at those ratings......there is no way that they could have really scored that low. They are a great boat, that are top notch in every way.

JD Power's is bogus, its all a scam.

I sell wakecraft boats and wished that someday, someone, some how will actually do an independent review of all boats. Epic, MB, Axis,Wakecraft ect.. are not fairly represented on this site, Wakeboarding Magazine,or JD powers. I have been at the NE boatshow and have gone through everyboat there. I rank as follows.
1 Wakecraft
2 Mastercraft
3 Malibu
4 CC
5 axis
6 Seadoo
I ranked according to quality vs, price.

C'mon Dan, you are a joke dude.

I know you sell WakeCraft so you are going to be hyped on the product but no way is a WakeCraft better than MC, Malibu, or CC.

You're going to rank a Seadoo over a Supra, MB, Moomba, Tige, Sanger or any inboard boat for that matter as a wake boat.

Nobody is ever going to take you serious with all your loony posts. You are hurting your brand, not helping.

Have you been on one. True Tige and Moomba should be ahead of seadoo.

The other companies are not at the show.

Dan, you are finished here. You've been owned for the 100th time.

even as a wakecraft dealer putting it ahead of of Epic is foolish...they have the same market but c'mon


Wakecraft = wakeboard only boat, pretty nice
but
Epic = runs on gasoline and wakecrafts.

Epic wasn't at the NE boat show either. I love epic and have been approached to be a dealer for them in this area.

i think malibu got alittle f'd in this. their dash got 3 stars but has anyone ever looked at the malivue... its sick... personally i think the dash on the MC looks like S#$T. but its cool i love the hell out of my bu...

...and seadoo being ahead of most inboards... fat chance.

Dan, you are making me hate the whole idea of wakecraft

What happen to Centurion ?

It's incredibly unfortunate for Wakecraft that Dan Dulong has become synonymous with the brand on this site. For Wakecraft's sake, I really wish somebody would ban him from posting... whether it be David Williams, or... wakecraft.

Back to the topic, agree... something about JD Power smells fishy.

it costs money for a company to be fully tested. if the company doesn't pay, a few surveys are sent out to make it look as if there was some competition. so one sour grape can go a long way. Malibu hasn't payed jd power in two years.
NMMA csi awards are more thourough, there isn't a winner, but a group of them. and money doesnt dictate it.

it's just propaganda.

Dan,

I will give you a fair shot here. Please tell all of us in what areas you believe a Wakecraft is superior to MC, CC or BU. I for one have owned both a CC and MC and I can tell you that they are top notch in many areas. I have not owned a BU but many of my friends have them. I will be honest and say that I have only been in a Wakecraft and have not ridden behind one, so I can not speak to the Wakecraft wake.

You continually boast about the quality and superiority of these boats, so if you could, please tell us specifically in what areas you believe they are better.

I just think it's funny that moomba is ranked ahead of supra in quality and reliability when they are THE SAME DAMN THING!

Cuz Moomba is cheaper, so they get the value vote.

On the engine thing. Indmar makes the engines, not the trannies if I am not mistaken. So the difference in performance could be as simple as a different tranny. Supra uses a walters tranny (not so good)with it's indmars. MC uses a ZF Hurth which is heavy as hell and very durable. Don't know what Bu uses. PCM is the only marine engine manufacturer that I know of that makes it's own tranny. I think that's why Nautie's are so money. It's built to work specifically with that engine. I love my X-star indmar, but I think PCM builds a better mousetrap for the Nautie.

I am not here to advertise. I was merely stating that there needs to be somebody that will independently review all boats. Sure I am biased towards wakecraft, if I didn't love them I wouldn't have bought one, which is the same for any boat owner. I think all of the major boat companies make a great boat. If I didn't own a wakecraft and was at the NE boatshow I would have bought a Mastercraft, Then Malibu, then an air nautique. That is just my opinion. Everyone on here is welcomed to theirs. I would only ask anyone before they knock something please check them out. Get on one and if possible ride behind one.

I did not look at Dan's Wakecraft at the NE show because I ran out of time.The Bu's were nice,the MC's were as well(seemed to be the priciest).I own a 210,so I obviously like the CC quality also.
What I can't understand, Dan,is how you could consider yourself a wake boat "rep" but rank the SeaDoo above the Tige and the Supra. For the $55K they were asking for the SeaDoo,I can only assume you never even looked at the Supra or the Tiges that were on display to arrive at that conclusion. i'd be wiling to bet 90% of New England riders have never even seen a Wakecraft. I've never seen one on the water up here. Most owners have their "boat goggles" on ,that's why those brands you mentioned aren't well represented on this site. They have a very small ownership percentage among members.

If you want to promote your product,maybe you should arrange some on the water demos,etc in your area. Talk is cheap.You gotta be able to put people in and behind that boat and show them what it's all about. I don't know if that is your first Wakecraft or not,but I do know the boat you had at the show is new and has not been run yet. Is there an Authorized Wakecraft dealer/service department in N.E. or do you have to take the boat 6 hours away for warranty work? Those types of things also factor into,as you say 'quality for the price".I would certainly hope that you have more experience with those boats than what appears on the surface if your going to tout them as being a better rig than the big three.

Dan I can appreciate the loyalty to the Wakecraft brand and I wish you the best of luck with your new endeavor. However most of what you are saying here on WW is irresponsible in both the tone and intent of you comments. Your intent from your first couple of choice posts and actions solidified your credibility as negative and seemingly deceptive. Coming from a fellow Wakecraft owner I respectfully wish you would make more thoughtful choices when representing the brand I like as well and give a little more thought into your actions on this site as well as reevaluate your goals here. Dan in due time and as more Wakecrafts get out there for others to have an informed opinion the information you solicit here will rise to the top and you will get your answers without feeling the need to be deceptive. So be more patient and thoughtful of other Wakecraft owners as well as Telling and his loyal crew who make his boats with him.

Sorry Dan but the Seadoo part of your post pushed me over the edge :-)

Mike if you had stopped by you would have seen that we were taking e-mail addresses from people so that we could notify them of demo days. We are even going to offer free tow days to any rider. I will send an e-mail stating where I will be on a given day and whoever wants a ride is welcomed to meet me. New England correct craft is the premier PMC service dealer and has agreed to do any work that is needed. I have owned a ford, chevy, ect.. and I always bring them to the same shop. If you live six hours away and need warranty work and want to go to your local repair shop then I and wakecraft will pay the tab for warranty work. Send me your e-mail and I will let you know when they will be.

Kevin sorry for any mistakes I have made. I just wanted to know what people thought and I felt that there needs to be an independent review system.

hahaha wakeworld...typical fanboy site.
I own a 210 and I would be happy for MC if they had won the award...whats wrong with you guys?

Why doesnt jd powers do a survey at one year of ownership , that would be a true indication of product quality and dealer servce.

Perhaps it's better to do a survey after 50 years... Then there is a true indication of product quality... Although there maybe not that many manufactures left...

People please, last year when MC was first you didn't hear any MC guys and now it's crap and scam... Every review of a product will be dependend and with a taste. Expeccially with cars and boats. So the whole JD-Powers will be a biased award, but every manufature get as much biased opinions as others.... It's is just an opinion of several owners and formed together to a sheet. Let it be. For me it reflects pretty accurate the truth, but I know that I'm biased and that my taste is personal...

Yes, I own a Nautique (also owned other brands).

Larson[xsmini] said NMMA awards are more thorough.
Nautique won that one too.

Did anyone read how Mastercraft was started????

MasterCraft was founded when the owners decided to start making their own boats. The owners took a Ski Nautique manufactured by Correct Craft and hung it from a tree and cut the back of the hull off in order to modify the hull to their preferences. The company's first ski boat was built in 1968 in a two-horse barn on a farm in Maryville, Tennessee.


I guess that's why they are number 2 behind Nautique....

^^ ARE YOU KIDDIN' ME?

man! for the longest time I thought MC's were handcrafted by the hands of god with the assistance of the Rolling stones, princess Diana and Céline Dion!!!!! now I'm sad.

I love it lets bash MC. Usually its Tige. Guys seriously from the top to the bottom there is only a 58 pt difference out of 950 which is not even a one percent difference. What I find funny is the engine. They are all chevy with different marinization. The opinion on engine could be the buyer cheaped out and bought an under powered boat and thinks the engine sucks. So is this biased probably not but does not really mean its a true apples to apples type of thing. I think the JD power thing is a joke in general cars boats etc. Would looking at that ranking really change anyones mind doubt it. If my CC dealer sucked and was useless I would rather have a blinged out loaded up Moomba with a GREAT dealer.

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quote:

By Dom W. Forte (fic) on Tuesday, February 17, 2009 - 3:54 am:

Why doesnt jd powers do a survey at one year of ownership , that would be a true indication of product quality and dealer servce.

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Actually they do! I received a survey at about the 6 month mark and another one a year later.

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quote:

By Larzon (xsmini) on Monday, February 16, 2009 - 7:34 pm:

it costs money for a company to be fully tested. if the company doesn't pay, a few surveys are sent out to make it look as if there was some competition. so one sour grape can go a long way. Malibu hasn't payed jd power in two years.
NMMA csi awards are more thourough, there isn't a winner, but a group of them. and money doesnt dictate it.

---

JD Powers DOES NOT TEST BOATS, they survey owners.

From the JD Powers site:

Power Circle Ratings are your guide to finding which vehicles ranked highest in J.D. Power and Associates consumer surveys. All Power Circle Ratings are based on the opinions of a sample of consumers who have used or owned the product or service being rated and are therefore indicative of a typical buying experience.

Since 1968, J.D. Power and Associates has been conducting quality and customer satisfaction research based on survey responses from millions of consumers worldwide. We represent the voice of the customer by translating survey responses from consumers and businesses into studies and reports that companies worldwide use to improve their business. In fact, J.D. Power and Associates has developed and maintains one of the largest, most comprehensive historical customer satisfaction databases in existence, which includes feedback on the shopping, buying, and ownership experiences for a variety of products and services.

No payoffs or any other form of advertising or bribes are done.

JD Powers basically ranks customer satisfaction. CC goes way out of their way to make sure that the customer is satisfied, while the manufacturers obviously have had a problem somewhere along the line. Also, according to Zan Schwenk, CC owners are nerds, so they fill out the survey form when they get them. Mastercraft and other boat owners are too cool to fill out the survey and send it back in.

Also, who do you think tells JD powers that you bought a boat?? It has to be either the dealer or the manufacturer, if you didn't get a survey, I wonder why.

It's all about your price point, first, then the dealer. Good call, tampawake. I get my boat worked on at Midwest MC and those guys are awesome. But, the Nautique dealer here in AZ where I live in the winter has historically done a better job with service than the MC dealer in AZ has. Different factors for everyone. So many variables.

Dan, that's cool. I would be interested in taking a ride behind the Wakecraft and checking it out. I'll tell you right now though so you know,I'm not a buyer. Happy w/my 210. Sounds like you're on the right track w/the demos etc.
I will email you if I don't make it back to the show.I may head back down Sat or Sun. The guys at NECC will take care of you. They treat me very well!FWIW, Craig has been in the industry his whole life and probably the first thing he'd tell you as a dealer is to stay out of the internet chat rooms hahaha

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quote:

By AMO (amo) on Tuesday, February 17, 2009 - 7:52 am:

It's all about your price point, first, then the dealer. Good call, tampawake. I get my boat worked on at Midwest MC and those guys are awesome. But, the Nautique dealer here in AZ where I live in the winter has historically done a better job with service than the MC dealer in AZ has. Different factors for everyone. So many variables.

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The Nautique dealer in AZ is probably one of the best dealers in the country as far as customer service goes.

By Tom (laptom) on Tuesday, February 17, 2009 - 5:25 am:

"Perhaps it's better to do a survey after 50 years... Then there is a true indication of product quality... Although there maybe not that many manufactures left... "

I like the 50 year idea! There would be only two brands on the survey list today... Correct Craft and Sanger.

Sam,are you talking about Century Marine? They are a top notch dealer. I would say Silver Spray Sports and Century Marine set standards that all dealers aspire to achieve. Nautique is lucky to have those dealers.

Next year will be the true test. The new owners of CC will have had control for a full year. I think they were still riding on Meloons quality of building boats the first year. I have a feeling with the way they are cutting corners they wont be winners next year.
Kinda like John Gruden winning the Super Bowl his first year after Tony Dungy left.
I'm glad to see the awards actually, it makes Mfgs tighten up a little. There is always room for improvement.

hahahahahahaha i wonder what kind of boats the JD guys have lol..... Thats is such bs

i think it should go by dealer, my molcal malibu dealer is a joke!!!!!!!!!! Never going to buy form them again... My last CC was a joke also!! I think all boats should rank on dealers!! Just got a Mastercraft and its looking better than the others so far

bu = andy

Billy, where is Nautique cutting corners? Are the '09 boats part of that cost cutting measure from the new ownership? And who the hell is the new ownership?

Towers are cheap as hell in 09'

What has everyone else done? It is good to see them stepping up. We will have this talk again next year when it is 8 in a row. GO NAUTIQUE!!!!!

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quote:

By Nick Tomsyck (sidekicknicholas) on Tuesday, February 17, 2009 - 2:09 pm:

Towers are cheap as hell in 09'

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Please explain... As far as I know and from what I have seen the towers are made from the same exact material as before. They added the Rosewell tower and it's anything but cheap.

They started getting them from China... they get to the states and must be fixed or they would be a huge hazard.... props for nautique to step up and pay to have them fixed once they are here, but -2 because it costs more in the long run and they outsourced jobs.
*I'm only talking about the swervy new style ones.... the new anything but cheap one** since you said it is Rosewell maybe it is their fault, not nautique and nautique is just honoring the contract but either way.... no good.

Do you remember the thread where someone saw one at a boat show and was shocked because the new "fixer" welds were covered with like spray paint or something....

thats what I want on my 75k boat, a re-welded, spray paint tower.

and all this is coming from a devout CC fan.


the new stuff they have is great looking, but no where near as functional as the old 210's.

they deserve the award too, but unless they step up they will NOT win next year

I remember that thread and the pics!

I know they don't look good, BUT, when done correctly the weld should be the strongest part in the assembly.

My point is they had to do the welds twice, because the first time was so worthless.

Pay a welder for 2 hrs of work or 4, which costs less?
How much bead can you lay before it looks like a 10 year old hucked mud at the tower?
Pay to paint the tower once or another time, spray paint or not?

-- and if you've seen that other thread how can you stand up for that tower, you clearly had knowledge it was cheap... but then went on to say, and I quote, "it's anything but cheap."

Nick, I don't think all Roswell towers are like the one that was in the thread.

My local dealer has the Roswell on all their 2009s and I didn't see a single one that looked bad. The finish and welds were as good as any tower I've seen on any Nautique. I hate the look of the new tower so I had to order my 09 to get the Titan.

... and as for as the strong part of the tower I doubt the weld it is. I've had two towers crack, right on the welds, stock welds non-the-less.

6061 Aluminum Tensile strength is around 45,000lbs
Aluminum Electrode for welding tensile strength is about ~34,000lbs

My guess is the weld is breaking first either way... and more-so if it has been done over and over burning the metal thin around it