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Old     (ehcanadian)      Join Date: Apr 2014       06-17-2014, 4:18 PM Reply   
Hey all!

So through some talking with a local dealer and good friend, we are now in the market for a new boat. Right now its a toss up between the 21 VLX, 22 MXZ, and 23 LSV. No particular order. The main concern of my parents (I'm helping with payments as well) is what we can expect depreciation wise?

The dealer talked us out of Axis because he had some concerns with how much we would loose over 2 years. And after sitting in a MXZ and LSV we couldn't look back. So my main question is on our 100k investment how much could we expect to loose after 2 years?

Notes: We treat our boats like gold and right now our 04 with 250 hours is near showroom new, put on a lift and averaging 60 hours each year for the last 3 years. All boats would be pretty much loaded if that helps.

Thank you all in advance!
Old     (mikeski)      Join Date: Aug 2003       06-17-2014, 4:23 PM Reply   
I'll take a shot at an answer for you...

$25k when you walk out the dealer door, $5k/year thereafter.
Old     (mikeski)      Join Date: Aug 2003       06-17-2014, 4:24 PM Reply   
that's assuming a $100k purchase price
Old     (cwb4me)      Join Date: Apr 2010       06-17-2014, 4:50 PM Reply   
You will be able to get a better deal between October and February which is boat show season. Then you wouldn't take as big a hit the first year.
Old     (Jeff)      Join Date: May 2010       06-17-2014, 5:41 PM Reply   
Ha! He said investment.

Check your state's tax policy on used, private party boat sales. In many states there is no tax on used boat sales between private parties. In Louisiana we only pay sales tax on what portion of the sales price is attributed to the trailer. Everybody here has "$100" trailers (and pays $9 in taxes) even on $100k used boats. Find a great used boat with just a few hours on it, let someone else eat that first big depreciation hit and the sales taxes and then find 3, 4 or 5 struggling military families to feed for an entire year with the savings.
Old     (ehcanadian)      Join Date: Apr 2014       06-17-2014, 7:06 PM Reply   
Just what I wanted to hear guys thank you!

And now that I realize it I should add some more info. The dealer offered me and my family an incredible deal for all the work Ive personally done (been doing a lot promo stuff for about 6 years and now one of the sales reps for our wakeboard shop plus a ton more) They offered my family promo deal meaning they put the shop name on the side of the boat, slip w/ lift, indoor boat storage for the winter, maintenance all taken care of and I get the boat for well well below MSRP and more near cost.

Robert- Boat will be a 2015 ordered in january, want to wait until i get more confident on a board again after a bad injury last year.

Jeff D - Ill have to look into the trailers thanks for that info. My dealer also mentioned a few solid used ones coming in, in october for new orders and I personally knowing all the owners of those boats it wouldn't be a bad thought.
Old     (riddick)      Join Date: Jan 2010       06-17-2014, 7:09 PM Reply   
The best would be to look into buying a 3 year old boat if your not concerned with having the benefits of custom ordering a boat to exactly what you want with the warranty you want.

If you look at boat values, the resell values start to flatten off around years 4, 5, and 6.

Typically, you can look at the MSRP of a new boat, then knock off around 35-45%. Thats what you'll loose the first year. Understanding that no one really buys at full MSRP, you can add in X% into the discounted purchase % to calculate a fairly decent resell price for the next year. Then around 5% per year for the next 2-3 years.

So, if you buy a new 2014 today for $100k, then want to sell it in 2018. I bet the resell value would be somewhere around $64,000+or -.
Old     (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       06-17-2014, 8:08 PM Reply   
I flip my boat every year. Expect the boat to sell after one year for roughly 30% off MSRP(100K MSRP will sell for 70K a year used). I'd guess roughly 5% a year after that. This is largely because more people than you think are buying in that 15-20% off MSRP range.

For most Manufacturers cost is around 25% off MSRP. Is that the deal they are offering you? Malibu is now a publicly traded company, so you should be able to find out what those boats are sold to the dealers for.
Old     (xstarrider)      Join Date: Jun 2007       06-17-2014, 8:56 PM Reply   
If you're getting a true "promo" deal ypu should be able to use that boat an entire season. Sell it at the end for a small profit and use the remainder as a down payment towards next years promo. ( this of course assumes you make payments on the deal chalked up to a "rental fee") I did this for 8 yrs straight with another mfg. You just have to keep in mind when ordering that u don't want crazy options, and outlandish gelcoat schemes. You want to order a boat based on popularity at time, and that will attract the biggest customer base. I would say 6 out of my 8 boats had contracts before my season even ended.


That's actually how I ended up w my XStar. Owner decided last minute to close up shop, I already had contract on my promo boat ..............could I have ordered a boat through the factory and still got a great deal sure. However then I would be sitting on a huge boat loan.

Last edited by xstarrider; 06-17-2014 at 9:06 PM.
Old     (illini88)      Join Date: Oct 2007       06-18-2014, 5:35 AM Reply   
The OP also mentioned "payments." Frequently, financing terms on a new purchase are better than what you'll get on a used purchase.
Old     (Froggy)      Join Date: Nov 2013       06-18-2014, 6:20 AM Reply   
Go to NADA boats you will find the max lending figures for each model and year. Since the boats are so expensive there are not many cash buyers out there. Next go to Only Inboards,Boat trader and Boats.com . Look for asking price for similar boats you can figure 10-20% off asking price. If you are thinking buying a boat as an investment you are going to find its a bad one. The true value of a boat is the great times you will have with it. If you have an IN with a dealer and want to flip boats every year you will find you will spend more time buying , marketing and carefully using the boat knowing every hour, stain or mark you put on it will cost you . Invest in something that will make money then buy the boat you like and use it .
Old     (WLF)      Join Date: Mar 2010       06-18-2014, 8:16 AM Reply   
Short answer: A LOT...but with that being said, I cannot think of another way that I could spend my money and get more enjoyment out of it. If you buy it for 25% off MSRP, and put 150 hours on it after two years I'd agree with the people above that it is probably going to level off around 60% of MSRP then go down about 8-10% a year there after. If you don't live on the water or use it often, it is hard to justify the expense and pain of putting it in and out.
Old     (chattwake)      Join Date: Jan 2010       06-18-2014, 8:20 AM Reply   
You can't judge depreciation by MSRP numbers. No boats sell for MSRP. What you lose depends on how you take care of your boat, how many hours are on it, what options you have, what kind of a deal you got on the front end, whether important changes occur during the next model year, which render you used boat less desirable or more desirable, etc.

All boats depreciate. There's no getting around that. I'm not sure that I agree that the Axis line drops quicker than the Malibu line. In fact, some would suggest that the Axis line may hold value even better than some premium lines, because they are relatively affordable to begin with, there's less chance of a catastrophic electrical failure down the road, they produce one of the best wakes in the industry, etc. From what I've seen, some of the largest depreciating boats are the most expensive, flagship boats. Many customers who buy G series boats want only the latest and greatest, are well off, and simply don't care as much about taking a hit on resale. Look at what some G's are selling for on OIB - there are at least two well optioned low hours 2013's for sale under 100k ( http://www.onlyinboards.com/Details.aspx?ID=43606 - http://www.onlyinboards.com/Details.aspx?ID=41286 ). What do you think those cost new? $130-140k? Heck, the other used G's on OIB are closer to $120k. Good luck getting ~$120, when others are asking sub $100k for comparable boats. Could you imagine actually losing $30-40k on a boat in a single season...
Old     (CarZin)      Join Date: Feb 2011       06-18-2014, 11:39 AM Reply   
There is a steep drop the first year. After that, it really slows down. Put down a hefty down payment if you are financing (15-20%), and you should NOT be under water if you sell in 5 years with 12 year financing. You should essentially be renting the boat for 5 years. Now, if you go with the 15 year financing, and opt to put down the minimum, you'll be upside down and should have a 10k contingency if you plan to sell at 5 years. More if you plan to sell sooner (due to the steep initial drop off).
Old     (ehcanadian)      Join Date: Apr 2014       06-18-2014, 1:43 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by xstarrider View Post
If you're getting a true "promo" deal ypu should be able to use that boat an entire season. Sell it at the end for a small profit and use the remainder as a down payment towards next years promo. ( this of course assumes you make payments on the deal chalked up to a "rental fee") I did this for 8 yrs straight with another mfg. You just have to keep in mind when ordering that u don't want crazy options, and outlandish gelcoat schemes. You want to order a boat based on popularity at time, and that will attract the biggest customer base. I would say 6 out of my 8 boats had contracts before my season even ended.


That's actually how I ended up w my XStar. Owner decided last minute to close up shop, I already had contract on my promo boat ..............could I have ordered a boat through the factory and still got a great deal sure. However then I would be sitting on a huge boat loan.
Thats almost word for word what the dealer had explained to me. however my contract is going to be for 2 years, I could negotiate for a 1 year contract. But he had mentioned after 2 years i could either have a 5-7k profit or break even. We just assume we would break even.

if you don't mind me asking what % above cost were they selling the boat to you for?


Btw thank you all for a abundance of info!

Last edited by ehcanadian; 06-18-2014 at 1:43 PM. Reason: post edit
Old     (cbarguy1)      Join Date: Dec 2012       06-18-2014, 3:14 PM Reply   
"If you look at boat values, the resell values start to flatten off around years 4, 5, and 6."

The above is very true at least in the top brand boats. We bought our 08 40th xstar in 2012 for $65k. Current list price for the same boat/hours is roughly the same.

The OP mentioned dealer support, service storage, slip use etc. That is worth a lot of money if you have to pay for it yourself (~$3-5k/year). If that is included at no charge it's makes the deal very attractive.

BTW, MXZ, very sexy boat. I highly recommend.

Last edited by cbarguy1; 06-18-2014 at 3:16 PM. Reason: x
Old     (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       06-18-2014, 6:19 PM Reply   
I pay dealer cost for my boat and break even after 1 year. Thats selling same model year(usually August). If I held it over the winter I would lose money. I know I couldn't get what I paid after 2 years. Making 5-7K after 2 years is a pipe dream. Also when I say break even I mean what I paid for it. Not even factoring in what I am paying payment wise, interest, etc. If you are paying cash that not an issue but if you pay payments count them as a loss. I consider it rent while I have the boat.

There are about 4 or 5 people a year I see pop up on here or other sites that get offered deals like you. Most are super excited at first, but as they put pen to paper they see its tough to even break even. Boats just depreciate to fast and to many people are getting great deals. The honest truth is figure its gonna cost you 1-2K a year. But thats not a bad deal to have a new boat ever season, IMO. Also consider things like you have to work the bugs out of a new boat every year. You have to set it up like you want it over and over. Like SWAT said, you have to lightly option them and get what people are buying. I can't stress enough DO NOT load up the boat. You'll never sell it for what you paid, as the option don't bring the return. I can give you 2 guys names right now sitting on loaded boats that were flipping them. I also install my own stereo and ballast as the factory options are to high. Also add the second battery. I do all that and don't even factor in my labor and I break even. Just food for thought.
Old     (polarbill)      Join Date: Jun 2003       06-18-2014, 8:09 PM Reply   
The good ole resale conversation. I am of the mind that no boat brand has better resale than another, at least not if based off of %. It is a bunch of crap that dealers and people with ownership goggles spout to either sell someone a boat or justify their purchase. Like Chatt mentioned, I think things like color, condition, options, location, how bad you got screwed by your dealer, etc... have a bigger affect on resale than the brand name on it. If you are trying to resell order the boat in nuetral colors, don't check every box on the option list, order a boat that makes sense in your area (don't order a 24' boat in an area that doesn't have big enough water to use it for example) and don't make a bunch make a bunch of aftermarket addons like a a big stereo or a wrap. You will see pennies on the dollar in return from those type of accessories/options.

Resale seems to have been really, really, really good across the board these days. Maybe because 10 years ago your could get a new 23' boat for 50k (premium brand) and 5 years ago you could get a new 23' boat for 65kish (for a premium brand) and now a premium brand 23' boat is in the 100k range. The boats are getting "bigger" and there are some cool new things like touch screens and surf systems but those in no way add 30k in boat. As long as we don't hit a recession and new prices keep going up used prices/resale will be good.
Old     (wakebrdr94)      Join Date: Jul 2010       06-21-2014, 6:54 AM Reply   
The only thing I know is with price increases every year on new boats, it's tends to help keep the resale values higher on used boats. In 2010 I got a good deal on a VLX, sold it in DEC 2013 for 2k less than I bought it for. Not bad depreciation IMO. Probably would have broke even if I would have waited until March or April to sell, but I needed to order my new boat.

It depends on your area, and the price you get from the dealer. Some parts of the country have a 10k+ difference in price. Which has a direct affect.

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