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Old     (logan)      Join Date: Dec 2011       09-08-2014, 7:31 AM Reply   
The 2003 SAN210 is still going strong, i love the wake on this boat at 80 feet. However it's seriously lacking space. So my question is how do these wakes compare. I don't wanna hear to look at boat a or boat b. Not concerned about anything other than wake vs wake because that's really all I care about when buying a boat (and price haha) thanks to those of you who can offer a real comparison.
Old     (tampawake)      Join Date: Mar 2008       09-08-2014, 7:50 AM Reply   
I feel your pain I have an 02 Xstar was thinking the same boat as well. Looking forward to the responses.
Old     (logan)      Join Date: Dec 2011       09-08-2014, 8:11 AM Reply   
I really don't want to change at all, my local axis dealer is gonna take me on a demo to ride soon. They've got a 22 with PNP so I'm gonna give it a shot. Been riding a 15 f22 Tomcat a lot lately, REALLY nice boat but that wake doesn't huck enough I feel like. Definitely large in size, but a little soft feeling.
Old     (kx250frider617)      Join Date: Aug 2013       09-08-2014, 8:37 AM Reply   
Do you mind fill in up bags manually?

I have a A22 and with factory ballast full, PNP with sumo 600's and 950 bow bag, and wedge down, the wake is big, pretty steep, and is best at 75-78 feet back. That setup is the best and doesn't require any manual filling. However, you'll have the same wake as anybody with an A22 haha.

Now if you don't mind bags. I run factory full, PNP (600's and 950 bow), and a sumo 900 in the cabin, and another sumo 600 in the bow, with the wedge up! That wake is insane! It's a tiny bit rampier than using the wedge, but its huge, and boots you.

I feel you will prefer the wedge, coming from a 210. I feel the wedge makes the A22 wake very similar to the 210 but only when all the factory and PNP ballast is full. Empty, the axis wake is laughable, the size is good but it has to be ridden at 65ft or closer. It definitely requires more weight than an 210, but there almost is no limit on how much weight you can add. The wake just gets better and better.

You've heard it thousand of times that the A22 wake is clean at slower speeds. I can run all my ballast and still ride at 22mph. With factory ballast and wedge, I can get down to 17-18mph. If that even concerns you. Everyone says the A22 isn't weight sensitive side to side, but a 200lb person can still mess up the wake if they are sitting in the wrong spot.

Honestly though, if the wake is your #1 priority, you really do have to ride behind one fully loaded.
BTW, see what bags are in the dealers boat. They might just have the small 400's and it's really not enough. Sumo 600's fit perfect!
Old     (xstarrider)      Join Date: Jun 2007       09-08-2014, 8:04 PM Reply   
I just went through a similar thing. Loved my 2000 XStar wake. It took me two seasons to finally pull the trigger on a new ride because everytime I test drive something I would walk away and think to myself is this wake better than what I have? I test drove the A22 the T22 and several other MFG's at that price range. The T22 was actually the better wake for me and I really like that boat better than the A series. It drove more like my Star, looked more like it, at had more of a compare able wake.

In the end though I ended up pulling the trigger on a mint 08 SANTE . Saved some cash in my pocket and could not be happier. It's the space and surf ability I was looking for. Even owning that older Nautique at an 03 I think when you get behind the wheel of that Axis and, spend some time in it at a demo, and then drive say an 08-2010 SANTE you'll easily make up your mind. If you really want the "new boat" though I felt the T22 wake was a bit steeper than the A series giving you that but more kick.

I know you said brand vs brand was out, but since you are liking for a pure wake to wake comparison. The wake I found to have the most identical kick and feel to my Star with 3k in it was a loaded up Mojo 2.5. It was hard with a nice lip.

Last edited by xstarrider; 09-08-2014 at 8:10 PM.
Old     (aricsx15)      Join Date: Jan 2014       09-08-2014, 8:40 PM Reply   
Swat, I would love to see some sacd pics of your 210. Bud over on TT is going through pretty much the exact same process you did.
Old     (logan)      Join Date: Dec 2011       09-08-2014, 8:55 PM Reply   
Appreciate responses from everybody. Looking forward to riding an a22 soon, if I can get air like this on that boat I will seriously consider one. Also looking to ride a SANTE220 weighted if anybody around the CA Delta has one! I've got beer and gas money!
Attached Images
 
Old     (xstarrider)      Join Date: Jun 2007       09-09-2014, 4:55 AM Reply   
Aric.

I got some of the surf wake but people started arriving early so have to hunt down some wakboard pics.I pulled the tanks added 900lb brostock sacs in rear, added 350 piggy backed off the center tank and have about 320 in pop bags stuffed in nose. While wakeboarding I can't run the 900 full Best guess is 700 each at 24.5mph. Wake is perfect. I was 80ft at 24.5 on my 2000 Stat now I am at 75ft as wake is wider.

As far as the 220. I test drove that as well as their price was about 5-7k less than 210. All the reviews say it's super sensitive weight wise but i didn't find it any different side to side than any other boat. It just took speed to clean it up. As far as wake with factory and 400's piggy backed off hard tanks and bow triangle in the nose the 220 wake at 24.5mph was a beast. It was peakier than the 07-13 210 with more vertical pop. I liked the wake a bit better than the 210 for that. With that said I have a family to consider as well Even empty the 220 wake is huge and u need to be around 21.5-22 to clean it up. My 7 and 10 yr old daughters would have tough time progressing on that. The un-interrupted rear bench/seating in the 210 compared to the 220 sold my wife more as well. No engine hump back there so you get smooth rear bench running the entire rear portion of the lounge. Hence why we went 210. Its much more beginner friendly at the low speeds. If I was just buying as a hard core rider i think I would've went 220 for the lippier wake. Just keep in mind it needs speed. There's not much out there info wise on the 220 but the experience I had behind it the wake was money for intermediate to advance riders.

We had 5 adults and 6 kids all under 11 in the 210 all weekend and never felt cramped one bit. My old star would have been a sardine can.


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Old     (brichter14)      Join Date: Jul 2010       09-09-2014, 5:03 AM Reply   
Logan you would get more air if you rode at 70' and dint take such a hard cut. Ive got the same hull as you.

Idk about a22 but ive ridden behind a sacked/wedged a20 and it was very very similar to the 210.
Old     (tampawake)      Join Date: Mar 2008       09-09-2014, 5:57 AM Reply   
Wow you finally pulled the trigger!!! Nicely done I think if I have a next boat it will be the same. If you dont mind send me a PM wonder what a decent 08 is going for. Congrats GREAT boat I would take it over and A as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by xstarrider View Post
Aric.

I got some of the surf wake but people started arriving early so have to hunt down some wakboard pics.I pulled the tanks added 900lb brostock sacs in rear, added 350 piggy backed off the center tank and have about 320 in pop bags stuffed in nose. While wakeboarding I can't run the 900 full Best guess is 700 each at 24.5mph. Wake is perfect. I was 80ft at 24.5 on my 2000 Stat now I am at 75ft as wake is wider.

As far as the 220. I test drove that as well as their price was about 5-7k less than 210. All the reviews say it's super sensitive weight wise but i didn't find it any different side to side than any other boat. It just took speed to clean it up. As far as wake with factory and 400's piggy backed off hard tanks and bow triangle in the nose the 220 wake at 24.5mph was a beast. It was peakier than the 07-13 210 with more vertical pop. I liked the wake a bit better than the 210 for that. With that said I have a family to consider as well Even empty the 220 wake is huge and u need to be around 21.5-22 to clean it up. My 7 and 10 yr old daughters would have tough time progressing on that. The un-interrupted rear bench/seating in the 210 compared to the 220 sold my wife more as well. No engine hump back there so you get smooth rear bench running the entire rear portion of the lounge. Hence why we went 210. Its much more beginner friendly at the low speeds. If I was just buying as a hard core rider i think I would've went 220 for the lippier wake. Just keep in mind it needs speed. There's not much out there info wise on the 220 but the experience I had behind it the wake was money for intermediate to advance riders.

We had 5 adults and 6 kids all under 11 in the 210 all weekend and never felt cramped one bit. My old star would have been a sardine can.


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Old     (logan)      Join Date: Dec 2011       09-09-2014, 9:22 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by brichter14 View Post
Logan you would get more air if you rode at 70' and dint take such a hard cut. Ive got the same hull as you.

Idk about a22 but ive ridden behind a sacked/wedged a20 and it was very very similar to the 210.
Thanks I will try that, I haven't ridden for two years so I'm putting it back together haha
Old     (LYNRDSKYNRD)      Join Date: Sep 2012       09-09-2014, 10:03 AM Reply   
FYI Axis wake will be wider than the 210 if you rode at 80 I would probably start at 70 on an Axis when you demo.
Old     (logan)      Join Date: Dec 2011       09-09-2014, 10:16 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by LYNRDSKYNRD View Post
FYI Axis wake will be wider than the 210 if you rode at 80 I would probably start at 70 on an Axis when you demo.
How would you compare width to an MB? I've been riding the F22 at 75' and enjoying it
Old     (LYNRDSKYNRD)      Join Date: Sep 2012       09-09-2014, 10:19 AM Reply   
Unfortunately I have never been in an MB.
Old     (Nordicron)      Join Date: Aug 2011       09-09-2014, 11:15 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by logan View Post
I really don't want to change at all, my local axis dealer is gonna take me on a demo to ride soon. They've got a 22 with PNP so I'm gonna give it a shot. Been riding a 15 f22 Tomcat a lot lately, REALLY nice boat but that wake doesn't huck enough I feel like. Definitely large in size, but a little soft feeling.

Your seriously not happy with the 15 f22? That boat now has 2800lbs of factory ballast. I rode a 14 couple weeks ago with factory 1800lbs full plus 650 bow sac full and about 400 or so more in the back and thought it was one of the best wakes I've ever hit! To me was better than loaded Xstar, San 210,x25, MXZ as well as a couple others! Only time I was just as impressed was when I demoed the g23 full with 6 people in the boat! Also how have u had so much time in the 15 f22? Didn't they just come out?
Old     (logan)      Join Date: Dec 2011       09-09-2014, 11:33 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nordicron View Post
Your seriously not happy with the 15 f22? That boat now has 2800lbs of factory ballast. I rode a 14 couple weeks ago with factory 1800lbs full plus 650 bow sac full and about 400 or so more in the back and thought it was one of the best wakes I've ever hit! To me was better than loaded Xstar, San 210,x25, MXZ as well as a couple others! Only time I was just as impressed was when I demoed the g23 full with 6 people in the boat! Also how have u had so much time in the 15 f22? Didn't they just come out?
Dealer had just got one in and my buddy bought it. I've been riding it for a few weeks, it's nice don't get me wrong. I'm not dogging it, but to me the wake feels soft. I dunno maybe other 210 riders will get what I mean. All I know is when I hit the wake on my 210 I feel like I'm hitting one of those turbo boosters on Mario Kart and it's sending me straight up in the air. While the MB wake is definitely bigger than mine, it doesn't give me the same feeling or the same amount of vertical lift. Beautiful boat but if I'm gonna own a boat, I have to love the wake. I wanna ride a weighted A22 and SAN220 to see what I like. I'm hoping to fall in love with the 220 wake because those aren't all that pricey right now and I've always loved the interior on that boat.

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