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Old     (LanceM)      Join Date: Jun 2014       06-03-2015, 8:27 AM Reply   
If a boat dealership goes under and the boats go off to auction... How would MC handle that? Buy all their boats back?
Old     (psudy)      Join Date: Dec 2003       06-03-2015, 9:36 AM Reply   
No but they should honor their warranties and if someone gets a new boat that is all jacked up, they should make it right without fail.
Old     (LanceM)      Join Date: Jun 2014       06-03-2015, 9:52 AM Reply   
Have you given the process time to actually work? Basically you are calling the CEO of Epic a liar at this point or at the very least implying that he will not do so...

Fly down to fix a boat? A new boat that really wasn't "new". Some of you guys are out of your minds... Have you ever seen the CEO of your CAR/BOAT manufacturers answer posts about warranty's at all, on any sort of public forum? And some of you find a way to rag on him or his word... The OP took his boat to a dealer that didn't even have the tool to read the codes and you think it should be fixed already... Give the process some time to work... Chris doesn't even know what to fix at this point...

Of course some of the WW people don't side with the Wakeboard company... If you cant side with a freaking Wakeboard manufacturer/innovator, what the heck are you doing here...

Yes I realize its day 12 or whatever.. I follow the thread myself... This is not going to be fixed till we know exactly what is wrong... Give it time!

LanceM
Old     (jws2)      Join Date: Apr 2015       06-03-2015, 11:22 AM Reply   
I am not buying a new boat, but I can say if I were it would not be an Epic!!! They could at the very least ,
A. Ship an owner manual, swim platform, mooring cover and pin for the tower
B. Call the trailer Manufacturer for the proper pvc guide pad
C. Talk to Mercruiser to get the engine issue resolved (quickly)
D. Offer to pay for a stereo shop to repair the issues with that
F. Have their attorney draft a letter to the scummy dealer, and shipper demanding that they repair other damages.

all of this would be fairly cheap compared to the customer service black eye this is.......
Old     (wiscxstar)      Join Date: Mar 2002       06-03-2015, 11:38 AM Reply   
blame game for sure.....make sure you spend extra money to have an independent inspect a new boat from an authorized dealer....sure ok isn't that a euphemism for "don't trust buying a brand new boat from our authorized dealer make sure you get a 2nd opinion".

I would just set a deadline for it to be handled, and if not handled correctly by then pursue your legal option. A new boat is a new boat, unless you advertise it otherwise. If you are selling it as new, but it is actually in a damaged and nonworking condition then you are simply misrepresenting it.

Last edited by wiscxstar; 06-03-2015 at 11:45 AM.
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       06-03-2015, 1:35 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by jws2 View Post
I am not buying a new boat, but I can say if I were it would not be an Epic!!! They could at the very least ,
A. Ship an owner manual, swim platform, mooring cover and pin for the tower
B. Call the trailer Manufacturer for the proper pvc guide pad
C. Talk to Mercruiser to get the engine issue resolved (quickly)
D. Offer to pay for a stereo shop to repair the issues with that
F. Have their attorney draft a letter to the scummy dealer, and shipper demanding that they repair other damages.

all of this would be fairly cheap compared to the customer service black eye this is.......
You are a dreamer. The manufacturer covers manufacturing defect, the issues on this boat sound like they are related to shipping and storage. He bought the boat from a liquidator at 20k less than retail, he has the responsibility to resolve these issues. Yes the manufacturer should help but it is not their duty to do so.

Do you know what happens if you force these uncontrollable costs on to the manufacturer? Price of boats go up.
Old     (jws2)      Join Date: Apr 2015       06-03-2015, 2:15 PM Reply   
Ralph honestly with the prices of boats these days it would be cheap pr (they have over doubled in 20 years)....... They give boats away every year for riders....... what is a few grand worth of parts and a little lobbying for all the good customer service. They would make it up in future sales, people want to do business with good people.
Old     (DatTexasBoy)      Join Date: Aug 2012       06-03-2015, 2:31 PM Reply   
I think that boat was at the DFW boat show in February, if Im not mistaken.
Old     (phillywakeboarder)      Join Date: Sep 2008       06-03-2015, 2:39 PM Reply   
This is an odd situation. Ordinarily, if a guy is buying a boat from a liquidator-type establishment, I'd put the burden on him to fully inspect what he's purchasing prior to the actual purchase. However, in this instance, Epic's website indicates that Texas Auto Liquidators is an Epic dealer. Consequently, I'd put the burden on Epic and Texas Auto Liquidators to make sure that a boat they are selling as new, which they did in this case, is, in fact, in perfect, like-new condition, particularly when they advertised it as having a full warranty, which they also did in this case. I have absolutely no experience with Texas consumer law, but given that they specifically advertised the boat as having a "FULL WARRANTY," my guess is that the boilerplate warranty disclaimer that followed is void, if it was ever valid to begin with. And, the mere presence of that disclaimer brings up another issue - is Epic really having or allowing its dealers, or entities which it suggests are dealers, sell its new boats with no warranties whatsoever, which the disclaimer is apparently trying to achieve? I'd be really surprised if that was the case, but its apparently what happened in this instance.

In the end, we have a guy who paid $60,000 for a new, full warranty boat from an entity that Epic, through their website, indicated was an Epic dealer, and instead received a boat with numerous flaws that doesn't run. Hopefully, Epic makes it right, and makes it right quickly.
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       06-03-2015, 2:52 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by phillywakeboarder View Post

In the end, we have a guy who paid $60,000 for a new, full warranty boat from an entity that Epic, through their website, indicated was an Epic dealer, and instead received a boat with numerous flaws that doesn't run. Hopefully, Epic makes it right, and makes it right quickly.
OK, i missed this fact on the thread and yes for me that throws things in a different light. Epic do have some responsibility if they are an approved dealer.
Old     (rexlex01)      Join Date: Mar 2010       06-03-2015, 10:53 PM Reply   
Basically a boat Manufacturer is only as good as the dealerships it sponsors on its Website.
The CEO shouldn't have to come on WW, but should make it's Website dealers make it right to attract more customers to that dealership. Don't take chances with 3rd party liquidators. Get some Authorized dealers.

How many here when on the fence for purchasing different brands, decided to opt out one brand for another based soley on a good reputable dealer?
Old     (cla17)      Join Date: Mar 2002       06-04-2015, 3:38 AM Reply   
I certainly understand the criticisms here. And in retrospect we should have re-inspected these boats at the plant before offering them to another dealer. But shipping a boat is NOT cheap and the decision was made months ago to just forward these boats to a new dealer for us. Texas Auto has a mixed business but is dedicated to opening a new boat centric dealership separate form their other operations and they have started with Epic because of our build quality, price and performance. We know they will become an amazing dealer for us over time. But this transfer boat deal was a curve ball while they are expanding their operations and it has not turned out well. I hope JJ will be back on the water soon and this issue will be a learning experience for both Epic and Texas Auto. And I hope the WW community will understand that issues arise from time to time and it is really how you respond and correct those issues that matter. I've always been one to personally go out of my way to help ANY owner with ANY brand of boat because I love the sport and boating in general. This case is no exception and I'm doing all I can to push for some finality here.
Old     (Nordicron)      Join Date: Aug 2011       06-04-2015, 5:31 AM Reply   
Cla17, well said! It certainly does sound like a huge curve that no one wants to be involved in!
Bottom line here is Texas auto really messed this up. And dealers make or break a brand! They have to understand that this is more than just flipping a used car and counting the cash. Hopefully they do good things down the road for Epic but for now they sure have f'd this up for u!

Epic is a cool boat and I love some of the design ideas! We need competition among the wake boats and we need boat manufactures that can hold Nautique and MC prices somewhat in check which doesn't seem to be working be still!
Old     (wiscxstar)      Join Date: Mar 2002       06-04-2015, 7:11 AM Reply   
Quote:
is really how you respond and correct those issues that matter
- this could have actually been an excellent advertising opportunity for Epic. If I were the owner of Epic, I would have responded with an over-the-top remedy (something like switching out boats with JJ). Sure, it would have cost money, but it would have been a way to show a LARGE amount of potential wakeboat buyers how awesome Epic is. The cost/benefit would have certainly been worth it, not to mention you are taking care of one of your own (Wakeworlders). Based on the Google reviews and BBB complaints for Texas Auto Liquidators, I have my doubts that they will be an "amazing dealer".

JJ - I am curious what is being done to "respond and correct" the issue?
Old     (phillywakeboarder)      Join Date: Sep 2008       06-04-2015, 8:08 AM Reply   
This entire mess could be resolved in a few days. Send a package which contains a new cover, a pin for the tower, an owner's manual, one trailer light, one trailer light reflector, one cap for the trailer wheel, and one new seal for the center window. Send a good Epic technician to the boat with the proper diagnostic equipment and my guess is he'll have the boat running within an hour. Before he flies back, have the technician install the new trailer light, trailer light reflector, cap for the trailer wheel, and seal for the window, and make sure that all the loose nuts and bolts and such aren't supposed to be attached to something. Finally, have the technician give a good faith estimate for the gelcoat and upholstery repair, provide a check for same, and follow up to ensure that the estimate covered the total expense. That would be the type of customer service that even the most vocal Epic critic would have a hard time finding fault with.
Old     (psudy)      Join Date: Dec 2003       06-04-2015, 8:56 AM Reply   
"Bottom line here is Texas auto really messed this up. And dealers make or break a brand!"

That is absolutely correct and why EPIC needs to jump on this quickly(which they might be now). With boats, there will always be problems, but with the prices they are asking for todays products, they better be warrantied like a vehicle. Things like this will happen from time to time but it shouldn't take a person to bash them on social media to get them to respond. They should have "responded to correct those issues" immediately. Just from the negative things I have heard about TAL, I would distance my company as far from them as possible.
Old     (SICKSPEED)      Join Date: May 2015       06-04-2015, 11:30 AM Reply   
Good points being made. I am trying to be patient to allow CLA17 and his team to make this right. I`m certainly not bashing Epic either. For sure mistakes will be made. What matters is how they make up for it.
One thing I want to reiterate is that I bought the boat at a discount typical of a "last years model" new boat (bought from an authorized dealer). So I feel that I deserve a far better product than I received. The amount I should have paid for this boat fully disclosed in this condition would have been significantly less than the $60,000 I paid.
To be fair, I have been in contact with Brad (from Epic) and he was forthcoming with info on what was supposed to be included with the boat and he has tracked down and promised to send most of these parts so far. He is still figuring out some details. The boat is still collecting dust in the shop. Hoping to hear something today.
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       06-04-2015, 1:09 PM Reply   
Before I cast judgement on any party: is there any pics of the damage/issues to the boat?
Old     (cedarcreek216V)      Join Date: Aug 2011       06-04-2015, 6:10 PM Reply   
Even the most respected manufacturers would not send a replacement boat right to a disgruntled customers door step, probably a far reach. But, the most respected would have the situation handled by now with little to no care how or why the boat is the way it is, that can be determined after the customer is made right and is happy and on the water.
Old     (Froggy)      Join Date: Nov 2013       06-05-2015, 6:18 AM Reply   
Dirty laundry indeed sounds like Epic needs a new washing machine. This kind of stuff is so destructive to the brand .I still remember a thread about a MC that spider cracked the entire side of the boat every body rejected the claim . It was dragged through the mud on social media until MC made a deal to silently end it and make it right for the owner. All I got out of it was MCs Lifetime hull warranty isn't so lifetime . Epic could have been the hero here instead it looks like they were forced into doing the right thing after they were exposed. time for damage control.
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       06-05-2015, 6:34 AM Reply   
But see, I see a few things that epic/mercruiser is responsible for, and a bunch of stuff the dealer and or shipper is responsible for....

Idk why this is coming back to epic? The guy didn't lake test the boat and have things fall apart on him due to the fault of the manufacturer, who then said too bad... Like the the MC example above me...

The boat arrived from clearly a bunch of hacks at the dealer/shipper over anything... But like I said, pics before judgement.

Epic should strip their dealer rights.

Last edited by simplej; 06-05-2015 at 6:40 AM.
Old     (psudy)      Join Date: Dec 2003       06-05-2015, 8:39 AM Reply   
Let me tell a little story of how a boat manufacturer handled a situation with us. Back in 2011 I was putting our boat away and noticed a bunch of spider cracks on the keel running down the bottom of our boat. We had the local dealer take a look at it. They claimed it was collision so we got our insurance involved. The insurance sent an inspector that did a xray(don't remember the exact name of the procedure) on the boat and discovered it was delamination.... Coverage denied as it was a defect. The dealership said they could fix it but they had to remove the top deck of the boat to get into the hull. It would cost roughly $20K(its a 30ft boat). This did not sit well at all. The boat was 10 years old and we are the second owners of the boat. I started remembering when we purchased the boat that we didn't extend the warranty over to us on the hull. We called the manufacturer to see what they had to say about it. We briefly talked to a lady there and all she said was BRING IT IN. We paid a guy to trailer the boat $500(both ways) from our lake where it stays to Neodesha KS. Cobalt fixed the boat without one question. That is how you keep customers coming back. When this one craps out, you can rest assured the next one will be a Cobalt.

Last edited by psudy; 06-05-2015 at 8:41 AM.
Old     (Cabledog)      Join Date: Dec 2013       06-05-2015, 8:54 AM Reply   
NEW boat purchased from the manufacturers authorized dealer is delivered as a POS. CEO is posturing and averting responsibility. = EPIC FAIL.
Old     (buffalow)      Join Date: Apr 2002       06-05-2015, 8:55 AM Reply   
We don't see the contract - What if the contract reads this boat is "as is". If so this case is closed.

Paul - I have a similar store with my '96 Tige. Lots of issues, back and fourth with dealer and such, in the end time drove it to texas fixed it all and basically sent me a new boat. I know MB has stepped in a few times in the last few years to make sure in the end that the client was happy.

This is a sticky once since we don;t have the list, photos, contract, what the agreement was, etc... At least the CEO is reaching out, but it does take time to sort through this stuff.
Old     (randv)      Join Date: May 2015       06-05-2015, 8:58 AM Reply   
I am surprised at all the heat being directed to Epic. Sure Epic should not appoint dealers that misrepresent their products, and they need to deal with this fast, but the buyer thought they were getting a deal that was too good to be true. Turns out it was!

I am genuinely sorry that the boat was so bad, and I hope the buyer gets it sorted, however they took a big risk and the risk didn't pay off.

Also, economically speaking, the manufacturer can't be expected to just indemnify the buyer if the dealer screwed up. If that was the case, what is the point of dealers. They have to add value to make it worth while for the good dealers to survive. If there was no benefit in being a good, caring, conscientious, go-the-extra-mile, type of dealer (which in itself has a cost for the dealer), they would all go out of business and all we'd be left with is dealers like the one mentioned here.

Epic should fire the dealer for sure (don't know why any one would appoint a boat dealer with 'liquidator' in the title), but the buyer took a higher risk than going to a reputable dealer, because they thought they'd get a higher reward. Didn't work out this time.

Well done Epic for coming on a public forum, might make you unique!
Old     (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       06-06-2015, 1:44 PM Reply   
Chris Anthoney is "THE MAN" this dude built his own wakeboard boat in a garage and then turned it into a brand. This guy is the ULTIMATE DIY GOD! Imo he has earned major respect, I think Chris and his ideas are about 5-10 years ahead of the industry I'm bummed his company/brand has not taken off like I thought it would.
I think epic's are cool boats and if I was in the market I would seriously consider one.
Old     (wiscxstar)      Join Date: Mar 2002       06-06-2015, 8:33 PM Reply   
Boat was listed: http://www.txcars.net/web/new/-Epic-...Texas/1712804/

Quote:
2014 Epic 23v Wakeboard Boat Brand New**Full Warranty
I woud like to see the contract too, but I can't imagine they would list as "brand new full warranty" and then say something else in the contract, but........oh wait Epic is selling boats via a used car dealership, so who knows.

I have been on Wakeworld since 2002 and I am a fan of what Chris has done with EPIC, but having a used car dealership as an authorized dealer....not a fan of that decision.
Old     (SICKSPEED)      Join Date: May 2015       06-07-2015, 12:43 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by randv View Post
I am surprised at all the heat being directed to Epic. Sure Epic should not appoint dealers that misrepresent their products, and they need to deal with this fast, but the buyer thought they were getting a deal that was too good to be true. Turns out it was!

I am genuinely sorry that the boat was so bad, and I hope the buyer gets it sorted, however they took a big risk and the risk didn't pay off.

Also, economically speaking, the manufacturer can't be expected to just indemnify the buyer if the dealer screwed up. If that was the case, what is the point of dealers. They have to add value to make it worth while for the good dealers to survive. If there was no benefit in being a good, caring, conscientious, go-the-extra-mile, type of dealer (which in itself has a cost for the dealer), they would all go out of business and all we'd be left with is dealers like the one mentioned here.

Epic should fire the dealer for sure (don't know why any one would appoint a boat dealer with 'liquidator' in the title), but the buyer took a higher risk than going to a reputable dealer, because they thought they'd get a higher reward. Didn't work out this time.

Well done Epic for coming on a public forum, might make you unique!
Randv, with all due respect, you may have missed the part where it was mentioned that these guys ARE in fact an Epic Authorized Dealer (same as any of their other dealers) as shown on Epics website. You are saying I took a big risk, but buying a used boat should be a risk. The whole reason I bought the boat was to AVOID risk. How wrong I was. ABSOLUTELY NONE of these issues were disclosed to me IN ANY WAY.
I have asked multiple times to give the boat back and be done with the deal but Texas Auto Liquidators has refused. Of course they did. They value my $60,000 over the satisfaction of a customer they took for a ride.

Last edited by SICKSPEED; 06-07-2015 at 12:44 AM. Reason: added small detail
Old     (SICKSPEED)      Join Date: May 2015       06-07-2015, 2:07 AM Reply   
Update: Day 16. Boat is still in the shop. They are nearly done diagnosing the problems but for sure it is missing at least one ECU or other control module. Mercuiser has said that they will not cover it under warranty because the part was stolen off the boat. Thats not to say they wont cover any other problems with the boat but honestly I`m unsure at this point. This boat is far from normal.
This is what I keep asking myself; Knowing that I agreed to a price of $60,000 for a new boat, what would have been a fair price for this thing if the true condition (and history) was properly disclosed?

Chris, is there any chance I can send this back and just get a boat thats actually new? I`ll even throw in a couple thousand on my end if thats what it takes. I just want a new boat that nobody has to make excuses for. Imagine the story I will have to tell when I finally sell this thing...

Last edited by SICKSPEED; 06-07-2015 at 2:09 AM. Reason: added a missing word.
Old     (Crosstx)      Join Date: Mar 2012       06-08-2015, 8:03 AM Reply   
I bought a used 2008 Epic 23v at auction a couple years ago KNOWING it had some issues. My boat has the Merc 8.1L SmartCraft and it was very intimidating once i had it in the shop and got to see the animal i was dealing with. I called EPIC and spoke with a few people and Bryan was a techni believe who would call/text me almost daily for updates. He then sent me a complete wire harness and ECM to try out and it did help me resolve the issue. Turns out some squirrel or something stole some wires of the harness causing it to short out part of the ECM and throw 15 codes.
We replaced both with new parts and sorted out some small gremlins due to sitting for a year and the boat has run flawless. We spent all day yesterday on the lake and i cant say enough good things about the service I received from epic on a older boat with no warranty. Not enough Merc dealers in my area with the scan tool for my engine. I did find a good one nearby and that is now where i get service/maint done and i love this boat. Makes the sickest wake. 🍻

Im sorry to hear about this deal and i hope that it will be sorted out in the end to your satisfaction.
Epic is a good company and they are still a small family of people there with alot of irons in the fire. Im sure that this is a regular topic in their discussions and they do a good job as far as i know staying on top of issues wether they are responsible or not.
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       06-08-2015, 9:15 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by SICKSPEED View Post



1. Huge rip in the fabric cover. -shipper/dealer

2. Gelcoat damage from improper towing with cover on.-shipper/you

3. Engine wont turn over or start at all. Completely inoperable. -mercruiser/epic/ insurance since the ecu was stolen

4. Missing parts list includes: -dealer/epic

- Pin for the wakeboard tower. (Cant use it without that.)

- Owners manual, and more...

5. Stereo wont power on. -epic

6. The bimini top was tossed in the bottom of the boat and it grinded a nasty 8 inch long patch in the gelcoat on the floor for the entire 2000 mile trip. -dealer/shipper

7. Trailer is completely missing one light and one reflector. -dealer/shipper

8. Trailer has been in some sort of accident where it was dented on the step just ahead of the fender. -dealer/shipper

9. Engine is throwing NINE different codes!!! Are you serious??? YES. NINE. -epic/mercruiser/insurance for stolen part

10. Rear swim step has multiple stress fractures looking like a spiderweb. Looks like it was backed into something. -dealer/shipper

11. Small hole on the driver seat left armrest. This is a very noticeable location for a hole. -epic

12. Various nuts, bolts and washers scattered under seats, on the floor, etc. Sloppy. -dealer didn't peep it properly. Just clean it up.

13. One of the chrome center caps on the wheel is cracked almost completely in. -dealer/shipper

14. Foam seal on the center window is peeled of about 3-4 inches down and mangled up. -epic



Here I made this easier for the OP.

Go after the parties above for getting things fixed. Next time you buy a used boat or a liquidated boat for 60k fly down and get it before you write the check.
Old     (SICKSPEED)      Join Date: May 2015       06-08-2015, 9:50 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by simplej View Post
Here I made this easier for the OP.

Go after the parties above for getting things fixed. Next time you buy a used boat or a liquidated boat for 60k fly down and get it before you write the check.
Yes thanks for the list but again, this boat was disclosed as perfectly NEW from an authorized Epic dealer. Not liquidated, repoed or used. This is the reason I felt a sense of security when I bought it.
For some crooked dealers NEW is apparently open to wide interpretation.
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       06-08-2015, 11:25 AM Reply   
The boat is new, it was never owned by anyone but you, it has just been mishandled somewhere between the photographs on the dealer site and its arrival to you. It's actually a great looking boat IMO, and seeing it certainly has peaked my interest in the brand.

You are extremely unlucky that your dealer/shipper did not handle the boat with the proper care. I would bet that they are an authorized dealer in that epic buys boats back that go unsold, and allows TAL to sell them, they have no 2015 boats in inventory.

The problem is, aside from the few minor pains associated with a handmade boat that isn't a Nautique, we can't really hold 1 party accountable for the problems.

I would be curious to see how epic has franchised the dealer, if they could fine them, drop them, or otherwise to force their hand a little bit to fix the issues that they caused.
Old     (ottog1979)      Join Date: Apr 2007       06-08-2015, 12:28 PM Reply   
This thread is great for discussion, post-analysis of a purchase transaction, and for public pressure on parties to get it resolved. But, the biggest lesson ought to be that it's imprudent to skip essential steps when making a $60,000 purchase decision. Sickspeed didn't do anything wrong, but he assumed some things and in this case, it led to significant problems. If he had seen the property prior to purchase, he would have known about the missing items, non-working order and cracking. To the extent these deficiencies weren't present at his inspection, then the shipper's participation in the problems would be obvious. If the manufacturer, dealer and shipper did everything as they should, there would be no post about it, no mess and heartache for Sickspeed. But alas, not everyone is as they should be. There also is no escaping some amount of buyer culpability in his current mess. That doesn't change, however, that he was wronged by less than scrupulous vendors. It' just means that the mess likely also could have been prevented.

Last edited by ottog1979; 06-08-2015 at 12:32 PM.
Old     (cla17)      Join Date: Mar 2002       06-09-2015, 10:46 AM Reply   
JJ - We appreciate you being patient while we get your needed parts out to your service center. ANY time off the water sux and we understand the urgency. In several cases we have taken boats with issues back to the plant for repair/replacement and return directly to the customer but this is a difficult process for you due to distance. You are pretty much the worse case scenario when it comes to shipping. I imagine you paid $2k+ to get this boat to you and it arrived in a VERY abused condition. We only recommend long travel on a flat bed to prevent trailer and general boat damage. This means it would probably cost $5-6k to get the boat to the plant and back to you. Along with two week of transit time and the actual repair time. For owners in Dallas this is an easy process but not for people in the Pacific Northwest. Hopefully we are on a path to rectifying these problems where you are at so this time and expense can be spared but it is on the table if need be. Keep us posted and you have my contact info for any questions.
Old     (jonblarc7)      Join Date: Jul 2006       06-09-2015, 11:19 AM Reply   
If there was a LIKE button I would hit it for this ^^^^^
Old     (lashburn1)      Join Date: Oct 2014       06-09-2015, 11:21 AM Reply   
I had NO Idea Epic was a Brand of Boats until today..
Not only that...But they are Made a Few miles from my home....
Good to see the Owner stepping in on a very critical Website/Forum to work with the Customer..

As others have stated, the Dealer Makes the Brand...

We have a Great Boat Brand...but just an Ok Dealer for our MC..

Good Luck JJ and Epic moving forward
Old     (CPanner)      Join Date: May 2015       06-16-2015, 7:23 AM Reply   
Any more on this? As a fellow Epic owner I'd like to see how they end up handling this.
Old     (SICKSPEED)      Join Date: May 2015       06-16-2015, 10:38 PM Reply   
UPDATE: DAY 26
Epic thought they knew what control module I needed for the boat and sent it out to me. After waiting all week for it it showed up of Friday. I left work early to take it down to the mechanic hoping I could finally get the boat fired up. When I got there I opened the package and to my surprise Epic had sent me a banged up USED 4 year old engine control module that had been used to diagnose issues on other boats. Getting used parts to fix my new boat really made me feel like a second class customer with a second class boat (as if I didnt already feel that way.)
After leaving he mechanic shop pissed that the boat I had just detailed was filthy and torn apart waiting for USED parts to be installed, I get a call when I`m almost back home saying that the part I had just dropped off wasnt even the right part. That was the last straw. I have been the ringleader in the fix-a-problem-boat circus long enough. The ONLY REASON I bought a new boat in the first place was to avoid this kind of mess.
My attorney advised me to send EPIC and TAL a certified letter formally asking them to take the boat back. They got that letter today. The only reply I got was from EPIC (nothing from the dealer) saying the same old song and dance that they will send more parts and pay more bills to work off the issues (on my time).
I`m no longer interested in that. I paid for a product and an experience that was not delivered to me and I`m not going to let them get-over on me.
At this point I`m going to move forward with legal proceedings as quickly as possible so I can be done with this before the rest of my summer slips by.
Old     (jdhart73)      Join Date: Mar 2010       06-16-2015, 11:11 PM Reply   
This boat is hideous…………..that is all.
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       06-17-2015, 4:32 AM Reply   
Lemon law it back to the dealer, as it should be.

Chalk it up to lessons learned.
Old     (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       06-17-2015, 6:56 AM Reply   
This legal process will take a VERY long time ... A friend of mine is going through the same thing (albeit on a used boat from a "dealer") and it's been ongoing now for almost 2 years with no resolution. Just a royally ****ed up boat collecting dust.
Old     (wakebordr11)      Join Date: May 2001       06-17-2015, 7:11 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by SICKSPEED View Post
UPDATE: DAY 26
Epic thought they knew what control module I needed for the boat and sent it out to me. After waiting all week for it it showed up of Friday. I left work early to take it down to the mechanic hoping I could finally get the boat fired up. When I got there I opened the package and to my surprise Epic had sent me a banged up USED 4 year old engine control module that had been used to diagnose issues on other boats. Getting used parts to fix my new boat really made me feel like a second class customer with a second class boat (as if I didnt already feel that way.)
After leaving he mechanic shop pissed that the boat I had just detailed was filthy and torn apart waiting for USED parts to be installed, I get a call when I`m almost back home saying that the part I had just dropped off wasnt even the right part. That was the last straw. I have been the ringleader in the fix-a-problem-boat circus long enough. The ONLY REASON I bought a new boat in the first place was to avoid this kind of mess.
My attorney advised me to send EPIC and TAL a certified letter formally asking them to take the boat back. They got that letter today. The only reply I got was from EPIC (nothing from the dealer) saying the same old song and dance that they will send more parts and pay more bills to work off the issues (on my time).
I`m no longer interested in that. I paid for a product and an experience that was not delivered to me and I`m not going to let them get-over on me.
At this point I`m going to move forward with legal proceedings as quickly as possible so I can be done with this before the rest of my summer slips by.
I am not trying to piss in your Cheerios but you gotta man up and take this thing to someone who knows how to fix it. Relying on epic to send you engine parts is suicide. It's got a Mercruiser engine - call around to find a shop that has the knowledge and tools to fix it - parts in stock that they can slap on it to get it running. Anyone with half an a$$hole for a brain should be able to spot missing control boxes/wires from a wiring harness not plugged into a missing ECM on an engine they are allegedly certified to work on. If the mechanic hasn't seen your engine before, take it to a mechanic that has. The fact that you brought it to a merc mechanic who didn't have the requisite tools to fix it or diagnose it sounds like suicide to me.

Not only that, but the mechanic you are trusting with your boat is making it dirty. I have knocked the running gear off the bottom of my family boat - boat was fixed and better than new in 2wks, and that was waiting for parts, removing everything, doing some glass gel work and reassembling/lake testing. Guess what, the boat didn't get dirty. It didn't get fiberglass dust in the interior. The dealer was faster fixing our boat than another local dealer tuned up a friends boat. This isn't rocket science here. Its a marinized Chevy V8, and a brand that has about a billion service centers nationwide...

I am willing to bet you could have had it fixed yourself in this amount of time. Stop being helpless and playing the victim on a forum. I am not saying you aren't the victim, but this dramatic writing piece on a forum is lame. Get it fixed, send Epic/TAL the bill and get on the water and enjoy your expensive toy.

Last edited by wakebordr11; 06-17-2015 at 7:13 AM.
Old     (Treybiz)      Join Date: Nov 2014       06-17-2015, 7:16 AM Reply   
Well thats disappointing. I was actually rooting for Epic to pull through.

But, I still have no idea why they thought a shady Arlington Used car dealer would be a good fit for a boat dealer. The Mid South Marine Place down the street from my office had the franchise first and they started as a used car place as well. Oddly enough I noticed there are Epic Bay Boats at the Fun and Sun Dealers in Hurst and Cleburne... Why not have them sell the wake boats? Fun and Sun has been around forever.
Old     (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       06-17-2015, 7:28 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakebordr11 View Post
I am not trying to piss in your Cheerios but you gotta man up and take this thing to someone who knows how to fix it. Relying on epic to send you engine parts is suicide. It's got a Mercruiser engine - call around to find a shop that has the knowledge and tools to fix it - parts in stock that they can slap on it to get it running. Anyone with half an a$$hole for a brain should be able to spot missing control boxes/wires from a wiring harness not plugged into a missing ECM on an engine they are allegedly certified to work on. If the mechanic hasn't seen your engine before, take it to a mechanic that has. The fact that you brought it to a merc mechanic who didn't have the requisite tools to fix it or diagnose it sounds like suicide to me.

Not only that, but the mechanic you are trusting with your boat is making it dirty. I have knocked the running gear off the bottom of my family boat - boat was fixed and better than new in 2wks, and that was waiting for parts, removing everything, doing some glass gel work and reassembling/lake testing. Guess what, the boat didn't get dirty. It didn't get fiberglass dust in the interior. The dealer was faster fixing our boat than another local dealer tuned up a friends boat. This isn't rocket science here. Its a marinized Chevy V8, and a brand that has about a billion service centers nationwide...

I am willing to bet you could have had it fixed yourself in this amount of time. Stop being helpless and playing the victim on a forum. I am not saying you aren't the victim, but this dramatic writing piece on a forum is lame. Get it fixed, send Epic/TAL the bill and get on the water and enjoy your expensive toy.
exactly
Old     (ottog1979)      Join Date: Apr 2007       06-17-2015, 9:07 AM Reply   
^x3.
Old     (SICKSPEED)      Join Date: May 2015       06-17-2015, 11:36 AM Reply   
You guys can assign blame to the buyer all you want but I doubt you would be doing the same if you actually ended up in my shoes. I did my job when I sent them the money. They sold me a false bill of goods. I have the boat at the only mechanic within 200 miles that could even look at the boat in a timely manner (remember this is PRIME boating season right now). They got the software update before the other mechanics could have even looked at the boat. Mercruiser would NOT warranty Epics missing parts so I was stuck.
Bottom line, I`m not gonna let these guys take advantage of me.
These businesses value your money far more than their reputation. I doubt any other brand would have let this happen.
Moral of the story is if you buy a NEW Epic boat, just know that it might actually be a beat up repo thats non-functional with a boatload of missing parts and problems you didnt bargain for. You will be expected to orchestrate the rebuilding process yourself, on your time (and with used parts). Great company. Highly recommended.

Last edited by SICKSPEED; 06-17-2015 at 11:37 AM. Reason: typo
Old     (wiscxstar)      Join Date: Mar 2002       06-17-2015, 11:41 AM Reply   
JJ Jordan - keep listening to the advice of your attorney. He or She is going to know what is needed to proceed under a lemon law or similar claim, and about preserving evidence. Although, I would agree that you may want to discuss with your lawyer about finding a new mechanic (your boat shouldn't get trashed from being worked on).

I have have had two Supras. However, when we were thinking about getting a new Supra boat somebody had come on Wakeworld with an issue on a new Supra boat. There was some messing around on it (and complaints on the message board - I was critical as well), but Rick Tinker showed up and the problem appears to have been solved not the run around you see here. That did influence my decision (along with having a great dealer Midwest Watersports/Midwest Mastercraft) and we ended up purchasing our new Supra last fall. Additionally, I purchased my first Supra a 21V slightly used, and we had some minor issues (but still frustrating as the boat was a major purchase - we bought it before we even owned a home), Supra stepped up and warrantied all the issues. We are bringing out new Supra in for the 20 hour inspection and have a few minor issues as well, but I assume they will all be resolved as has been my experience. Not trying to be a fanboy here, but taking care of customers is not just about having happy customers, it is about having them return as future customers, having them refer other customers, and having the word get out that they take care of customers which creates new customers.

I think Epic is going to get a little different result here, as they should based on their response.
Old     (ottog1979)      Join Date: Apr 2007       06-17-2015, 11:59 AM Reply   
"No positive change can occur in your life as long as you cling to the thought that the reason for your not living well lies outside yourself."
Irvin Yalom
Old     (Cabledog)      Join Date: Dec 2013       06-17-2015, 12:07 PM Reply   
JJ, I would consult with your attorney regarding this thread and if it is prudent at this point to keep the proceedings confidential pending the outcome. I would hate to see comments on this board affect your outcome.

Sorry for your EPIC FAIL. Best of luck.
Old     (sailnaked6842)      Join Date: Aug 2014       06-17-2015, 1:06 PM Reply   
Yeah, this is seriously not the fault of the buyer. This is the fault of a dealer MISREPRESENTING THEIR PRODUCT. Are they auto-liquidators? Yes, but that does not release them from, when advertising a product as new, providing a new product. How many of you order products from Amazon? If Amazon shipped you an air compressor with a crack in the tank and a components missing would you kick yourself in the ass for not going to the warehouse and inspecting it there? Deal is it was sold as new and should be sold as new. Epic should provide at the very least a demo boat for JJ to use while they take the boat back to their manufacturing center or dealer and have it warrantied there. This is fair and would get their brand more recognition than simply having quality of product.

Secondly TAL should take all the blame and anyone who thinks otherwise is out of touch with reality. Texas Auto Liquidators is tarnishing EPIC's name, pure and simple. They accepted delivery of a boat that was in poor condition and listed it as new and sold it as new. They did not say "new boat, some damage" which would release them of liability. They knew their was damage and sold it, but that's how they conduct their business. Also they implied a full factory warranty when stating, in the title, it was brand new with full factory warranty. To then state later "vehicle is sold with no warranty" is a total misrepresentation and again harms EPIC. If TAL wants to be a dealer for EPIC they're off to an awfully bad start.
Old     (hferrell12)      Join Date: May 2015       06-17-2015, 1:15 PM Reply   
I almost wrote something similar to Delta force on day 1, and then again on day 20. Both times I was actually feeling bad for you, once I had to go back and delete my comment. Seriously though, it's been a month and you're still handling this thing exactly like my wife would after 10 beers.

Everything comes down to one real question for me.....How does some amass the kind of wealth where they can risk $60,000 on an unseen boat 2,000 miles away & not have the intelligence, determination, or grit necessary to solve a problem.
Old     (wakebordr11)      Join Date: May 2001       06-17-2015, 1:37 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by SICKSPEED View Post
You guys can assign blame to the buyer all you want but I doubt you would be doing the same if you actually ended up in my shoes. I did my job when I sent them the money. They sold me a false bill of goods. I have the boat at the only mechanic within 200 miles that could even look at the boat in a timely manner (remember this is PRIME boating season right now). They got the software update before the other mechanics could have even looked at the boat. Mercruiser would NOT warranty Epics missing parts so I was stuck.
Bottom line, I`m not gonna let these guys take advantage of me.
These businesses value your money far more than their reputation. I doubt any other brand would have let this happen.
Moral of the story is if you buy a NEW Epic boat, just know that it might actually be a beat up repo thats non-functional with a boatload of missing parts and problems you didnt bargain for. You will be expected to orchestrate the rebuilding process yourself, on your time (and with used parts). Great company. Highly recommended.
Wrong, you buy a boat sight unseen from a used car dealership, caveat emptor buddy. You didn't test drive the boat! A marine surveyor and $400 could have saved this head ache. Or a flight to TAL ($400). Or request that they start the stupid thing and send you a video of it.

There are 10 Mercruiser Service Centers within 90mi of Yakima, Wa. Seattle is 2.5 hours away. Our dealer is 2.5 hours away, it's worth it...

Your issues are with TAL, the shipping company, yourself for trusting anyone with $60,000 cash AND THEN finding a reputable mercruiser mechanic - which you haven't found yet or else the boat would be fixed. And I don't believe for a second that there isn't a dealer between you and Seattle that couldn't have hooked the boat up to a diagnostic quick and seen there was a missing ECM or control board. There is no reason this boat shouldn't have been in the water 2 weeks ago despite the issues you've had.

The sensationalizing that happens on this board is insane.
Old     (psudy)      Join Date: Dec 2003       06-17-2015, 2:53 PM Reply   
"Wrong, you buy a boat sight unseen from a used car dealership, caveat emptor buddy"

1) They are an authorized Epic dealer.
2) The boat was advertised as brand new.

If it was advertised as a used boat I would absolutely agree but it wasn't. The words "brand new" come with an expectation of just that.
Old     (YYCBoarder)      Join Date: Apr 2013       06-17-2015, 2:56 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakebordr11 View Post
Wrong, you buy a boat sight unseen from a used car dealership, caveat emptor buddy. You didn't test drive the boat! A marine surveyor and $400 could have saved this head ache. Or a flight to TAL ($400). Or request that they start the stupid thing and send you a video of it.

There are 10 Mercruiser Service Centers within 90mi of Yakima, Wa. Seattle is 2.5 hours away. Our dealer is 2.5 hours away, it's worth it...

Your issues are with TAL, the shipping company, yourself for trusting anyone with $60,000 cash AND THEN finding a reputable mercruiser mechanic - which you haven't found yet or else the boat would be fixed. And I don't believe for a second that there isn't a dealer between you and Seattle that couldn't have hooked the boat up to a diagnostic quick and seen there was a missing ECM or control board. There is no reason this boat shouldn't have been in the water 2 weeks ago despite the issues you've had.

The sensationalizing that happens on this board is insane.
You and others here are being way too hard on this guy. I wouldn't expect to have these kind of problems buying a "new" boat with warranty and then get the run-around trying to get it fixed. TAL may be a "used dealership" but are an authorized NEW dealer for Epic (and even endorsed here by Epic).

How many people here went to a boat show, saw the model of boat they liked one the floor and bought a different one because they liked the colors/options better? The boat show here is in February when the lakes are frozen so it's impossible to test ride. We bought a new boat that we never saw until we actually picked it up. I think it would have been a little ridiculous to ask the dealer to send me a video of the boat running. Would these same people be bashing me if it was a lemon that wasn't being taken care of by the dealer and/or manufacturer?

IMO, he's done way more than he should have to get it fixed. Maybe there is a closer mechanic that could have fixed it but as a consumer how do you even who is competent, honest, knows the boat and is willing to take something like this on?

Last edited by YYCBoarder; 06-17-2015 at 2:58 PM. Reason: spelling
Old     (SICKSPEED)      Join Date: May 2015       06-17-2015, 6:41 PM Reply   
Trust me when I say that this is not so much an issue of "CAN" or a question of my "grit". I`m sure I CAN rebuild the boat with a Corvette engine if I wanted to.
The whole reason I bought a new boat from a new boat dealer is so I wouldnt have to.
You`re right though. Since I didnt fly out there or hire a "Marine Surveyer" to inspect a brand new boat I surely deserve to get a 2nd class barge full of problems.
All this is easy to second guess after the fact.
Also there are plenty of dealerships that sell a mix of new and used cars, boats, RVs etc all in the same dealership. In 2015 this shouldnt be considered alarming. Its strange to me that some people on here have never heard of this. All the boat dealers near me are this way. Similarly the word "liquidators" in the case of a car dealership name is just a buzzword. They get their vehicles at the exact same sale as every other dealer.
Old     (illini88)      Join Date: Oct 2007       06-18-2015, 6:16 AM Reply   
How was the boat titled to you? New or used?
Old     (augie_09)      Join Date: Mar 2011       06-18-2015, 12:08 PM Reply   
keep checking this thread hoping to see "it's all resolved and we had a great weekend on the water". We're rooting for you to be on the lake and enjoying life! :fingers crossed:
Old     (MalibuGold)      Join Date: Oct 2014       06-18-2015, 12:53 PM Reply   
I know EPIC seems to be trying to fix the problem. The main issue I have is that EPIC would deal with someone like Texas Auto Liquidators. I mean all they had to do is visit the facility and talk to the people there and they would know they were shady individuals. It took me all of 5 minutes to figure it out. This means that EPIC doesn't care about their reputation. If you have not been there you have no idea how bad these people are. I wouldn't buy a rubber ball from then because they would find a way to give you a fake one. They sell only on the internet because that is how they get over on people.
Old     (SICKSPEED)      Join Date: May 2015       06-18-2015, 9:23 PM Reply   
Truth be told, I have yet to receive a title. No idea why.
It says on all paperwork that its "NEW WITH FACTORY WARRANTY" in big capital letters just like that.
@MalibuGold
Youre right bro. They got over on me simply because I put too much faith in a new product, thinking that EPIC actually cared about their reputation. Today they AGAIN flat refused to take the boat back even though I havent signed a single paper, titled it or even received the title.
All they care about is making a sale and taking your money then doing the minimum they can to avoid a lawsuit. No consideration for the customer who gets taken for a ride. If I do end up keeping this boat (because they FORCE ME TO against my will), the first thing I will do is take off any and all Epic logos.
Old     (SICKSPEED)      Join Date: May 2015       06-18-2015, 9:45 PM Reply   
In the last two emails from Epic, their CEO has tried to blame the whole thing on shipping damage. Ignoring the fact it was an uninspected repo with known issues. The quotes here are verbatim.

"After talking with everyone and looking at pics I have to come to the conclusion that this boat should have been shipped differently. Gel coat, trailer, cover, bimini, stereo and upholstery damage along with a significant stolen part from the engine are all things that could have and likely did happen in the many mile transit from the Texas to you."
Then he goes on to downplay the whole thing saying:
"Neither TAL or Epic is just going to take this boat back which is missing one small engine part that can be installed in 10 minutes.

Shipping was your responsibility and you signed a sales contact with TAL stating such. The service was only arranged as a courtesy by TAL and any damage that occurred via shipping is not the responsibility of TAL or Epic. Yet we have both said from the beginning that we will help make it right.

ALL of the parts have been offered to you free of charge and service to repair shipping damage that was neither TAL or Epicís responsibility has been agreed to be reimbursed. We feel this is FAR beyond both TAL and Epic responsibilities here."


This is not true. I have not signed one single piece of paper on this barge. Furthermore the "shipping company" was a nice old man with an Escalade that WORKS FOR Texas Auto Liquidators!! Not a licensed and insured 3rd party shipping company.
Talk about throwing that poor guy under the bus. I hope he reads this.
Plus why play the blame game and say it was his fault when he WORKS for TAL?? Talk about passing the buck. TAL is a bunch of crooks and Epic in Epics eyes they can do no wrong.

I personally like the part where the the ECU got removed and the stereo quit working from shipping damage. Grandpa was rocking out? Maybe thats why both batteries were dead too right?
Old     (rexlex01)      Join Date: Mar 2010       06-18-2015, 10:06 PM Reply   
I have some friends who moved from the midwest to the south and woke up one of the mornings at their hotel and all of their lifes possessions were gone. Someone took their 40' trailer of antiques, etc.
Hotels are prime spots for theft.
Old     (wiscxstar)      Join Date: Mar 2002       06-18-2015, 10:20 PM Reply   
You didn't sign anything on the whole transaction? Post up the sale paperwork, just redact your personal info.
Old     (ottog1979)      Join Date: Apr 2007       06-18-2015, 11:03 PM Reply   
Things are not adding up. You send $60,000 to Texas "without signing one single piece of paper"?
Old     (SICKSPEED)      Join Date: May 2015       06-19-2015, 12:28 AM Reply   
Thats correct Andy. They sent me paperwork but I never signed anything.
Old     (randv)      Join Date: May 2015       06-19-2015, 1:14 AM Reply   
Wow this is not getting any better is it! I hope you successfully sue TAL, but that may take some time. Have you reached out to them for a 'settlement'? I struggle to see how they have a case if they sold the boat as new. I'm not familiar with US law, but if TAL were responsible for the delivery, then you should be OK there as well. Just may take a while for your lawyers to get a response.
Still am not sure why Epic would want to have dealers like this!
Old     (burban89)      Join Date: Nov 2006       06-19-2015, 5:30 AM Reply   
I could understand some things coming loose during shipping and maybe a scratch here or there from road debris/rocks etc. but come on anyone who believes all that was from shipping should not be in charge or run a company. Not just anyone is going to jump in a boat and still parts. If they were going to steal anything it would be stereo equipment, racks, etc.

I do not know what Epic makes in a year but they could have easily spent the money to fix this problem in the first few weeks and got some really good advertising by JJ coming on here and telling that story instead of all this negative feedback. The time they have spent giving him the run around could have fixed the boat twice probably. That is what I do not understand. 1 boat sale maybe 2 would have made up for their loss on this one. Instead they will lose sales for this.

Epic may not care about fixing this one boat but I know they will lose sales from this and I for one looked at Epics and wanted one before I got my Nauti. I will never look at another one.

I know these things happen with all boat companies but this is probably the worst way to handle a problem. I work in customer service and I purchase 300-500k in tools and material a year. When a company does not want to fix a mistake that is truly on their end or wants to blame the shipping company when I know that there is no way it was a shipping issue, that company no longer gets my business.

There are to many companies out there that care and want to take care of their customers to settle for a company like this.

Stick it to them JJ wish I could help!
Old     (whiteflashwatersports1)      Join Date: Dec 2012       06-19-2015, 5:44 AM Reply   
This situation sucks - EPIC and TAL both totally suck and everyone who has bashed you on this forum sucks. I hope this works out for you. I would be postal if I bought something that was "new" from an "authorized dealer" and had to go through this crap.
Old     (racer808)      Join Date: Jan 2013       06-19-2015, 6:01 AM Reply   
I really don't get why this particular site is such a bug light for a**h***s. I'd be furious and buying boats and high end cars site unseen is rather common. I'm sorry for your troubles man. Epic isn't even on list of possible due to this and a few other things I've heard about their low quality
Old     (Laker1234)      Join Date: Mar 2010       06-19-2015, 8:08 AM Reply   
I'm no lawyer but below the website says, ""DEALER makes no representations, expressed or implied, to any actual or prospective purchaser or owner of this vehicle as to the existence, ownership, accuracy, description or condition of the listed vehicle's equipment, accessories, price, specials or any warranties. Any and all differences must be addressed prior to the sale of this vehicle."" If you did not sign a contact before the sale stating a warranty or repairs, your chance at a lawsuit is not good. However, as a business owner, I would be doing what I could to make it right. I found out a long time ago the only thing that courts in a courtroom is what is in writing.
Old     (brodee42)      Join Date: Jun 2015       06-19-2015, 9:43 AM Reply   
Long time lunker on this forum...I've been watching this thread from day one waiting for a surprise great outcome from Epic or TAL.

This story is ridiculous...I purchase cars and trailers ALL the time sight unseen. Yes, I expect some differences of interpretations of condition but NEW should be NEW!

I agree with some previous posts that this is a PERFECT opportunity for Epic to make things right and get a customer for life, plus a great customer base. I appreciate the fact the owner of Epic came on the thread to post but the solution and should've been better! What a missed opportunity...These opportunities can help or break a company! Funny because I've always been interested in Epic boats but now after following this "Epic" failure of customer support, I'm not a fan!

Good luck with this whole process! Soon it will all be over and hopefully a story to share with many beers!!!

Hope you get on the water soon.

Jason

Last edited by brodee42; 06-19-2015 at 9:48 AM. Reason: .
Old     (mark197)      Join Date: Dec 2009       06-19-2015, 9:58 AM Reply   
You have not signed any paperwork yet you sent a $60K to them? How did you know that there wasn't a UCC against the boat? I hate to say it but without a title or a lien release your problems might just be starting. If I was in your shoes and the check was not cashed yet I would have the bank stop payment on it immediately, and hire a lawyer.
Old     (all2matt)      Join Date: Apr 2015       06-19-2015, 10:49 AM Reply   
WOW, is all that can be said. I had no TIGE dealer within 5 hrs of me when I moved to north dakota. I wanted a Tige and called them up, they helped me order a Z1 straight from them and set up the shipping to my house from texas. All this sight unseen and when I got the boat it went straight inot the water and was great from day 1. This is what JJ wanted and should have gotten with a NEW boat. Holy Crap am I thankful that didnt happen to me. My brother in law bought an EPIC a few yrs ago and it came with a bent shaft causing the boat to rattle and shake, shouldve been caught at the facotry. Stories like this are what gets the smaller manufacturers put out of business. Maybe unfairly or not when I get something from a smaller company I expect better customer service because I feel like Im working with a person and not a corporation, thats why I would choose the little guy over the big one. I agree with others EPIC shouldve stepped up quickly fixed everything then came on to brag about the great job they did. Thats how you get customers. It wouldve been awesome to read how EPIcs CEO was able to set this one guy up that got a raw deal. It wouldve opened up more potential customers that may buy his boat. Now they have basicly no chance from anyone thats read this thread.

Last edited by all2matt; 06-19-2015 at 10:52 AM.
Old     (augie_09)      Join Date: Mar 2011       06-19-2015, 12:48 PM Reply   
if the delivery driver is an employee of TAL or was hired by TAL, I'd get the documented ASAP. That effectively means you didn't take possession until it arrived, correct?

You need to start documenting everything, exact dates, dialogue of phone calls, etc. Build your case.

File a report with BBB against EPIC and one against TAL, today.

the missing ECM being 'stolen' is pure speculation by EPIC. It's just as likely, if not more so, it went missing while on TAL property. What thief goes after a ECM board first? None. More likely TAL serviceman pulled it or it was never installed and water test didn't happen. Where's the document showing the water test happened? I got one with my new boat. If they didn't provide one, it didn't happen.

I think I am going to send my dealer flowers or a box of chocolates, because this thread makes me love my dealer.
Old     (bcrider)      Join Date: Apr 2006       06-19-2015, 1:09 PM Reply   
Why do people always suggest going to the BBB. You know the BBB is a farce right!? It really means nothing and they aren't able to do anything anyway. The only reason the BBB ever endorses someone is because that business paid to be endorsed. Again, the BBB is a waste of space.....that's like going to Yelp.
Old     (Treybiz)      Join Date: Nov 2014       06-19-2015, 2:02 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by augie_09 View Post

I think I am going to send my dealer flowers or a box of chocolates, because this thread makes me love my dealer.
LOL.... Dealer I bought my boat from treats me like I bought a brand new G25 everytime I walk in the door. They will always have my business now.

If bought what was advertised as a new boat from a factory authorized dealer with all this nonsense I would have lost my mind.
Old     (cla17)      Join Date: Mar 2002       06-19-2015, 7:34 PM Reply   
Slight thread hijack - I've been busy(and am still in the hospital for at least another day) with the wife bringing in a new addition to the Anthony clan Ally will be on a board soon enough!!!

As for this situation, I found this thread on WW and that was the first that Epic knew of this situation. I immediately said we apologize for the circumstances that has caused this sever annoyance and offered to help. Along with TAL(who agreed to help as soon as notified as well) we started addressing every issue one by one. Epic has sent out over $1,000 worth of parts(a new custom cover, trailer step pads, and tower mirror) without question and additionally sent out a $1,000+ service ECU to get this boat on the water quickly(which was unfortunately the wrong part but we were ready as soon as we find out to order the correct part or have JJ service agent order it with our approval). TAL also agreed to cover detail costs of $800 to get the boat back in cosmetic shape.

I don't understand how this situation has become so inflamed when both TAL and Epic have never once said we would not help make this situation right. Cosmetic issues - Approved to be fixed, Non Engine Parts - Sent out and Tower bolt ordered even though all of these issues can be verified to not exist in the pictures TAL took to list this boat. Now the only issue left is the ECU for the motor and Epic is ready order this part or let JJ's service agent order this part with our approval but JJ will not put us in touch with his service agent to approve this.

There is simply nothing more that Epic can do here without cooperation. Both TAL and Epic have worked hard to help facilitate this boat getting on the water quickly. Our response may not have been perfect but we have tried to work this problem to solution. Problems listed, solutions identified, solutions put in motion, now cooperation from JJ has stopped.

I see no way this boat gets back on the water without cooperation in installing this ECU. This is sadly a "help us, help you" situation now...

All we need is the phone number of JJ's service team to get things moving. If this service team would have contacted us as soon as they knew the ECU part we sent was wrong they would have had a new part earlier this week. Now it has stretched through another week of summer... It makes no sense to me why this boat shouldn't be fixed by now...

I REALLY want to see this boat on the water and pics of it being enjoyed the way it should be!!!
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Old     (SICKSPEED)      Join Date: May 2015       06-19-2015, 8:04 PM Reply   
Thank you all for the outpouring of support. It feels good to know that people here would have expected the same square deal I did.
Congrats to Chris on his new baby, I`m sure its a happy time for you and your family.
Back to business. All you`re doing is posturing. You lost my trust when you tried to send me a 4 year old used workbench mule to replace the most expensive electrical part on my boat.
No one here thinks I got a fair deal on this boat of that you are "making it right" by simply helping me repair this thing on my time. Its a deal I dont want and didnt sign up for. You guys are holding my money hostage and stuck me with a bait and switch. You should be helping me rather than covering up for your dealer.
I`m still waiting for parts you said you would send and didnt. I`m talking about the cover, the trailer light, the tower pin, trailer light, wheel cap. I dont have the rubber strip for the window thats still falling off, stereo is still not working. The boat isnt fixed yet, no wetsand, nobody work is done, I dont even yet have an estimate for the damaged trailer and swim step, not one check has been signed yet. Even if you wrote checks for all this crap and sent me all these parts do you really think its fair that your customer got the boat in this condition and then had to deal with the runaround to fix all this crap?
You and your helpless dealer (who has no business selling ANYTHING that floats) have not offered one penny for all my time invested to finish building your boat for you. You REFUSE to give me a refund for a boat that I dont want and still dont have a title for. Not to mention all the time I could have been USING this boat. Your idea of making this right only makes it right for you. I`m not an unreasonable man but I`m also not a pushover that will be taken advantage of. Its not my responsibility to finish building your boat during MY wakeboard season.

Instead of standing behind your dealer you should try standing behind your product.

Last edited by SICKSPEED; 06-19-2015 at 8:07 PM.
Old     (wiscxstar)      Join Date: Mar 2002       06-19-2015, 9:25 PM Reply   
I don't know if other's agree, but Chris you are really starting to irritate me. Your authorized dealer sold him a beat up, missing parts, non-working Epic as new....that is just wrong ( I have seen the listing it says "brand new". You seem to have an issue dealing with that. On top of it, how in the heck do you not know what part to send on your boat, and why would you send a used part...that is also just wrong. How does that even happen? I also find in very disingenuous for you to then switch the topic to bring in your new baby (obviously to gain some sympathy). That works because it even makes me feel bad typing this knowing that you just had a new little baby (cute by the way). Business is business and you need to make this right. Give the guy his money back, and take the boat back to the factory to get it back to "new". TAL actions and your responses are the reason people have to get lawyers...
Old     (Khyber)      Join Date: Mar 2013       06-19-2015, 9:49 PM Reply   
Next time buy a Mastercraft X80 brah

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