Articles
   
       
Pics/Video
       
Wake 101
   
       
       
Shop
Search
 
 
 
 
 
Home   Articles   Pics/Video   Gear   Wake 101   Events   Community   Forums   Classifieds   Contests   Shop   Search
WakeWorld Home
Email Password
Go Back   WakeWorld > Boats, Accessories & Tow Vehicles

Share 
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old     (dud77)      Join Date: Aug 2009       09-15-2011, 7:19 PM Reply   
I have a 2005 x-star put the PWT ballast system in it. Called Eric at OJ got the 14.75x13 prop for the MCX indmar engine and with full ballast I can't plane out to save my life.

I hammer down and it gets up to like 15MPH the nose is straight up and that's all it has. If I run to the nose it will plane out and hold speed at 24 mph but that sucks.

What can I do to make it better? More weight in the nose? Less in the back?

Trade it for a nautique?
Old     (spf2275)      Join Date: Mar 2011       09-15-2011, 7:38 PM Reply   
X-Stars are definitely weight sensitive in the nose. You need more weight in the nose and you'll be set.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Old     (denystaucd)      Join Date: Feb 2003       09-16-2011, 12:40 AM Reply   
I have a similar setup boat/ballast/mcx, I'd run more front weight. The wake will thank you for it. Also I run the Acme 1285 4 Blade 14.5 x 14.25 and it doesn't have the planing problem you described. I'm think of trying the Oj 5 blade prop next though.
Cheers,
DC
Old     (jason95gt)      Join Date: May 2006       09-16-2011, 10:54 AM Reply   
If you completely fill the PWT setup then you really need extra front weight. Also go with an ACME prop. The 1285 is great but the 2195 is even better! Gets on plane significantly faster than the 1285 and only spins 300 rpms more at speed. We ride an 06 w/MCX at 23.5 and we are at 4000rpms. We don't fill it completely though but the couple times we have it is still a noticeable difference for planing. Let me know if you want this prop as I can get you one.
Old    readyaimfire            09-16-2011, 11:12 AM Reply   
I had a smilar issue with my '09. I put some lead in the nose and now it seems fine.
Old     (snowslider76)      Join Date: Mar 2002       09-16-2011, 11:29 AM Reply   
I have the exact same set up as you ballast, prop and mcx, different year but nothing changed really. You just need more bow weight, I run everything full plus about 280 in sand in the bow, two 70lbs bags under the port side right under the glove box, and two 70 lbs bags, behind the starboard wall that covers the wiring. Plains fine with your same prop until I have more then four people then I'll drain some down in the rear, I never take any out of the front. Sometimes I'll run another 400lbs bag in the bow if I have a bunch of people, the wake is a monster but the plain time is unreal slow, you/we are just at the limit of what the MCX can do.

IMO you have the best prop, I've tired all the Acmes and I'm not knocking they just don't get the MCX up as fast, the pitch isn't there. Also I had my OJ recupped and it made a difference I went from running 40/4100 rpms at 24.5 mph to 38/3900 at 24.5.
Old     (dud77)      Join Date: Aug 2009       09-16-2011, 5:12 PM Reply   
Thanks I'll add some weight tomorrow.
Old    fowl            09-19-2011, 10:41 AM Reply   
Get an acme 14.5 x 14.25.
Old     (dud77)      Join Date: Aug 2009       09-22-2011, 6:09 PM Reply   
Put 350 lbs in the noise plus 2 dudes 170 lbs each. Me in the drivers seat 190 my 100 lbs wife in the pass seat beside me. 1 150 lbs rider and the boat won't get above 12 MPH. Good oil pressure 160 deg engine temp. I have full PWT ballast plus factory. I'm at a loss. Drop half the weight and I'm good to go. I have to have an ECM problem right? Or is the MCX just not capable?
Old     (holdsworth)      Join Date: Jan 2010       09-22-2011, 7:41 PM Reply   
Empty the stock (hard) tanks in the rear and it will be fine.

Just out of curiosity, what kind of riding are you doing that you have to have pro ballast filled completely + body weight?
Old     (dud77)      Join Date: Aug 2009       09-22-2011, 7:56 PM Reply   
I'm out right now. I blew my ACL going big on a tantrum to blind. Everyone that rides my boat has several inverts. Not doing 9s but we do like a big wake. Had a 210 nautique loved it. Sold it to get something bigger and so far that's a big mistake.
Old     (cwb4me)      Join Date: Apr 2010       09-22-2011, 8:01 PM Reply   
Get an epic.It has a big wake.
Old     (holdsworth)      Join Date: Jan 2010       09-22-2011, 8:12 PM Reply   
Once its dialed, you won't regret it. I have an 04 with stock plus about 1800 including people and am satisfied with that (pops still owns the boat and won't budge on pro series yet...sucks).

That engine is underpowered for that much weight... buying the MCX was the only mistake. The 6.0L or 8.1L are what you should have been looking for.
Old     (OneMoreSet)      Join Date: Aug 2011       09-22-2011, 9:21 PM Reply   
Dudley - which 210 did you have 07+ or pre 07? out of curiosity. What weight did u run in it for comparo?
Old    readyaimfire            09-22-2011, 10:08 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by cwb4me View Post
Get an epic.It has a big wake.
Seriously?
Old     (polarbill)      Join Date: Jun 2003       09-22-2011, 10:43 PM Reply   
Dudley, Something doesn't add up here. There are plenty of people that run 3500-4500 pounds in xstars with the MCX. I think Travis use to run that much in the boat all the time. If you have all the stock ballast plus the pro tour ballast filled you have a lot more weight in the rear. Are you sure the front tanks and sacks are all full? What does the rear ballast come to? 2000? While the front is 1000-1200 or so? Like someone said, empty the rear stocks or add a 500# sack or lead to the walkway. This will get you a lot closer to 50/50 or 40/60. Right now you are probably around 33/66 front to rear. The other thing is listen to the guys on hear about what prop to run. Once you get it dialed I am sure you will be more then happy with the wake behind the star. Now if you are expecting an older SAN210 wake that is like hitting a solid curb I am not sure you will ever get that. The other thing is that it could be something wrong with the transmission/engine.

Last edited by polarbill; 09-22-2011 at 10:48 PM.
Old     (johnny_defacto)      Join Date: Sep 2006       09-22-2011, 11:00 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by readyaimfire View Post
Seriously?
Atleast he didn't say "get a TIGE. It has big graphics"
Old    readyaimfire            09-22-2011, 11:13 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnny_defacto View Post
Atleast he didn't say "get a TIGE. It has big graphics"
Yeah, I was shocked to not see a pic of a blue tige. But getting an epic isn't exactly gonna solve the problem with his xstar.
Old     (dud77)      Join Date: Aug 2009       09-23-2011, 6:51 AM Reply   
I did have the older 210 and I realize it's going to be tough to ever get that wake out of another boat. I just want this thing to plane out. There could be something wrong with the Engine or Transmission, probably going to take it to the Mastercraft dealership this weekend. The boat only had 140 hours on it so I would hope nothing is wrong with the engine or transmission but who knows. Actually I hope it’s something minor wrong with it that they can fix.

The boat does have the 14.75x13 OJ. I could look at the ACME but they are very close to the same dimensions and pitch from what I understand.

The setup was as follows yesterday. 1400 in the back (Which is the PWT ballast bags) stock tanks in front of them full (250 each), center stock tank full (500), then (500 for the PWT bags in the front) I then added 350 lbs of steel. I had 350 lbs of dudes in the front. So the ratio should be 1400 rear and 1200 in the front. I also ran to the front when we got up to 12 MPH to try and get it over the hump with no luck the speed actually started to drop down to 11 MPH after a minute or so.

It would only get up to 4000 RPMs at 12 MPH. If I dump the system it will get up to 4600 RPMs at 32 MPH (which is top speed).
This is a new boat to me so something could be wrong with it. No way Mastercraft put out an $85K boat as their signature series wakeboard boat and expect people not to load them down. Right? The only thing that worries me is empty this thing runs like a top. It jumps out of the water. Jason said above he runs the same setup. If it's full and will plane out then I must have a problem with the engine or transmission.

Thanks for all the help guys.
Old     (SS_Hooke102)      Join Date: Sep 2011       09-23-2011, 7:06 AM Reply   
My dad has a 2010 x-star with the mcx that we put one hundred hours on this summer. We ride with "pwt" ballast 750 rears and the 250-300 fronts. We have to drain the hard rear tanks fill the front hard, front PWT's and have two people in the front generally and it usually works great! Good luck bud!
Old     (njskier)      Join Date: Jul 2005       09-23-2011, 7:09 AM Reply   
John, I have the same boat as you. Currently running the OJ 14.75 X 15.5 prop with no troubles.
With extra ballast/people I run the OJ 14.25 X 14.5 and it has plenty of holeshot.
Perhaps your engine needs a tune-up? All it takes is a bad plug or wire and you will lose alot of power.

BTW, I don't use the rear hard tanks at all.
(2) 400# sacs in the rear (soon to be 720's)
KGB full
750# sac in the walkway

The wake is sweet!
Old     (polarbill)      Join Date: Jun 2003       09-23-2011, 8:13 AM Reply   
John, that really sounds weird. Have you checked the transmission fluid? Could the tranny be slipping due to low fluid? If it is running up to 4000 RPMs but you aren't able to get it above 12 mph there has to be something wrong somewhere. Check the transmission fluid, make sure it is red/pink and that it is full but not overfilled.
Old     (geterdone)      Join Date: Oct 2005       09-23-2011, 8:47 AM Reply   
http://www.boattrader.com/listing/20...-Team-99601079
Problem solved!!
Old     (dud77)      Join Date: Aug 2009       09-23-2011, 9:24 AM Reply   
That's funny. I guess now I have a 2005 Xstar for sale. Perfect condition no problems at all.
Old     (polarbill)      Join Date: Jun 2003       09-23-2011, 9:28 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by dud77 View Post
That's funny. I guess now I have a 2005 Xstar for sale. Perfect condition no problems at all.
Is this a joke or are you just the most impatient person alive.
Old     (dud77)      Join Date: Aug 2009       09-23-2011, 9:52 AM Reply   
Yes it's a joke. No chance I'm selling a boat I just bought a couple months back but yes I am pretty impatient as well. I figure we all of us pay alot of money for these boats and it's not too much to expect them to do what they were built to do. This boat has 140 hours on it. SURELY that a built to last longer than that without major problems. I do actually hope something small is wrong with this boat and can be fixed. I love how the boat looks and I love the creature comforts so I'm going to do all I can to make it right. That being said if I bought a Ferrari and it would only do 50 MPH I would probably be disappointed.
Old     (holdsworth)      Join Date: Jan 2010       09-23-2011, 10:01 AM Reply   
250-300's up front with pro series? It's 2-750's in the rear lockers and 2-500's under the bow flip ups. Do you have the right bags?
Old     (snowslider76)      Join Date: Mar 2002       09-23-2011, 10:02 AM Reply   
Hmm seems weird man, and this is going to be a dumb question but sometimes simple things get over looked, you don't have PP set to 12mph do you? Probably not but we've all looked in the engine box when our boats won't start only to figure out the kill switch lanyard was off.

You have the absolute best prop for the job, changing to an Acme won't make a difference it's that low pitch of 13 that get's it out of the hole.

Do you know if the fuel pump has ever been replaced? There are a couple years that it was bad on the MC's, had mine done when my boat basically did the same thing. The big difference was my boat wouldn't get on plain no matter the weight, and it just wouldn't stay running. I guess it's possible if it's not getting the right fuel pressure under an extreme load it could cause this problem. I'm no mechanic tho.

Also you're probably a little overboard for the MCX at this point. Instead of having your homies sit in the front, get um in back and drain down the rear PWT bags 25% or so. I said more then four people I typically drain down the rears, I should have said four people, because the boat won't plain it's just how it works. For example and I've tried this, if I run ballast all full, then an additional 500 lbs in back, boat won't plain, if I add 500 lbs to the bow boat still wont plain, the MCX just can't push that much weight. The MCX works the best with around 3k in extra weight, doesnt matter if it's ballast or people, honestly if you go 100lbs over that I think you run into the problem you are having, doesn't matter where the weight is.

I think your numbers on ballast are a little off too:
Rear:
Stock tanks 2 x 250 = 500 + 2 x 500 = 1500
Front:
Front stock 500 + 2 x 250 = 1000 + 350 steal + 350 dude = 1700

Get the dude weight in back and drain those rear bags down 25-30%, as close to 3k as you can, if it still doesn't plain take it in.

I've been through all this figuring out myself so I'm pretty sure I'm spot on. I always run with a full tank as well, as the tank drains during the day I will fill the rear bags more. It's pretty crazy how sensitive that rear weight can be, sometimes if it's not quit right I'll literately empty rear tanks for 15 seconds and it'll be fine.

Also remember the engine computer recalibrates every time you change weight, so the first plain with a weight change is always the longest. After that it should get up faster.
Old     (snowslider76)      Join Date: Mar 2002       09-23-2011, 10:03 AM Reply   
"250-300's up front with pro series? It's 2-750's in the rear lockers and 2-500's under the bow flip ups. Do you have the right bags? "

Incorrect.
Old     (polarbill)      Join Date: Jun 2003       09-23-2011, 10:13 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by dud77 View Post
Yes it's a joke. No chance I'm selling a boat I just bought a couple months back but yes I am pretty impatient as well. I figure we all of us pay alot of money for these boats and it's not too much to expect them to do what they were built to do. This boat has 140 hours on it. SURELY that a built to last longer than that without major problems. I do actually hope something small is wrong with this boat and can be fixed. I love how the boat looks and I love the creature comforts so I'm going to do all I can to make it right. That being said if I bought a Ferrari and it would only do 50 MPH I would probably be disappointed.
If you bougth a used ferrari that had been railed on and not taken care of would you still expect it to run as good as a brand new one? Point being, 140 hours and 6 years is plenty of time for someone who doesn't take care of or neglects something to fudge it up. This is why a well taken care of 750 hour boat may be better then a neglected 100 hour boat. Another thing is boats don't do all that great if they jsut sit. If the previous owner used the boat 130 of those hours in the first couple of eyars and then just let it sit for 3-5 years it could of caused problems. Anyway, it sounds like you are taking it to the dealer to have looked at. Don't blame it on Mastercraft though if something major is wrong. Blame it on the previous owner or just by odd chance something failed. There is only one way I know of to get around this. Buy a brand new boat every couiple of years so that when stuff goes wrong it is covered under warranty.
Old     (snowslider76)      Join Date: Mar 2002       09-23-2011, 10:19 AM Reply   
^^^That info really isn't going to get his boat on plain
Old     (dud77)      Join Date: Aug 2009       09-23-2011, 10:30 AM Reply   
1 gallon of water 8.35
gallon per cubic inches 231

Bag length Bag Width Bag height Total Cubic Inches
40 22 22 19360
40 22 22 19360
40 22 6 5280
40 22 6 5280
Cubic Inches per bag Gallons per cubic inch lbs. per gallon total lbs. per bag
19360 231 8.35 699.8095238
19360 231 8.35 699.8095238
5280 231 8.35 190.8571429
5280 231 8.35 190.8571429


Front bags are the PWT 40x22x6. If you do the calculations water weight in gallons. Calculate that down to gallons per cubic in then divide the numbers you get 250 for the front bags. They are wedge shapped so there is a little fudge factor involved without some complex trigg. The back bags are 40x22x22 that equals 699.999 lbs again there is a little fudge because they are not square. The entire system is 1900 lbs per wake makers so I'm thinking 700 per back bag equals 1400 that leaves 500 lbs / 2 which is 250 so that was my verification of my math.
Old     (snowslider76)      Join Date: Mar 2002       09-23-2011, 10:49 AM Reply   
Ya I meant 700 in the rears and typed 500 and screwed up my math, just saying the front bags are no where near 500 ea.
Old     (holdsworth)      Join Date: Jan 2010       09-23-2011, 11:19 AM Reply   
Ah, guess I misheard the dealer or the bags were different up front.
Old     (holdsworth)      Join Date: Jan 2010       09-23-2011, 12:24 PM Reply   
^^^ different in the boat that we took a test ride on*
Old     (michaelspsp)      Join Date: Sep 2007       09-23-2011, 5:40 PM Reply   
I got this one. sort of. 2 scenarios with my 2004 xstar with pwt ballast and oj prop, this july 4th we were out tubeing for about 2 hours. ok, big lake, late afternoon, 8 16 year old girls on my boat with me and my gf, one was her daughter. oh and her other daughter who boards. first i should say that the day before me, my gf and her daughter that boards went out and rode no problem. ok, next day we are tubeing for 2 hours. its getting later and the south end of greenwood lake is calm. really good conditions let alone that it was july 4. i get in the water. say yes please. i get pulled out of the water in slow motion. i see my gf telling some girls to get in the bow. did nothing. I get in the boat and nail the throttle. it goes more than half way down before the rpms come up. i drain the ballast-all of them. oh and i look at the throttle cable. nothing. drain the ballast and nail the throttle. boat doesnt go over 4000 rpm. the next day. it was fine. how?

second scenario. 2 years ago axis matt and daniel walden come up from TN. we go out. have a good time. i wasnt paying attention when some one fell and let the water come over the stern , sun pad and into the boat when i pulled back the throttle . the rider is ready i go to hit the throttle. the bow comes up, we send everyone up front. does nothing. we go for lunch and let the boat dry out. go back out and all is well. this scenario happened a few times. at least twice that year it happened AS SOON AS WE WENT OUT.. didnt happen at all last year. i guess i have more questions than answers!
Old     (denystaucd)      Join Date: Feb 2003       09-23-2011, 10:07 PM Reply   
John,

When you go to the dealer find out about your fuel filter. If it hasn't been replace ever it could be concerning. Also the catalytic converter could be a problem, not sure if the 05' has it . Both these are problem that come up under heavy load.

As mentioned earlier I have an 06' xstar MCX with the acme 1285 and run factory and fly high ballast with another 400# in the walk way (4000-4200#'ish). Takes a bit to get going but does the job. The perfect pass is my main problem, not the MCX. The perfect pass sometimes has to be stepped up to from 21-22 to 24.5 mph while going, to get it to be stable.

Hope you get this figured out.
Cheers,
DC
Old     (jason95gt)      Join Date: May 2006       09-24-2011, 10:14 AM Reply   
All of you running the PWT ballast completely full with another bag up front NEED to contact me to order up a 2195 ACME. It will solve all your planing issues with only sacrificing 400rpms at speed!
Old     (michaelspsp)      Join Date: Sep 2007       09-24-2011, 10:32 AM Reply   
sorry jason its not a planing problem. it planes fine when the engine rpms reach where they need to be to plane. I talked to Travis Moye 4 years... 5 years ago and got the same exact set up he had. once the problem was there, with NO ballast it wouldnt go above 4000 rpms. in both my situations it corrected itself same day or next day. my mastercraft mechanic thinks its an electrical issue or a throttle problem. NOT a prop problem because 99% of the time its works great.
Old     (dud77)      Join Date: Aug 2009       09-26-2011, 9:11 AM Reply   
Found my issue and it's kind of funny. I owe mastercraft a small apology. I found a log stuck on the strake fins under my boat. I guess I picked it up first day and just never looked under the boat. I always dry the boat off but never really reach under the boat. This weekend I was cleaning it before going to the dealership and one of my buddy's noticed it. It was 8" thick roughly and 4 inch deep by 10 inches long. I decided to take it out anyway and give it a try before taking it to the dealership. The boat got up on plane with full ballast. I was also able to get it up to full speed with the ballast full 30 MPH. That's a first since I bought the boat. I loaded it down with 6 people and full ballast and gave it a try. I got on plane but didn't like it. I dumped 25% of the back ballast and it did much better. Thanks for the advice guys. I still am a little disappointed with the MCX but hey it will do the job. I'm going to add more weight to the front to help out the the wave looked big really big. Also, we did some surfing with only the back PWT bag and the factory bag full and dumped everything else. It looked really good. I might have a keeper in this boat, can't wait for the ACL to heal up now so I can get back on the board.
Old     (wakeandsnow27)      Join Date: Jun 2004       09-26-2011, 9:25 AM Reply   
wow...glad you figured it out. Kind of funny- a lot of solutions and good help here though!
Old     (jeff_mn)      Join Date: Jul 2009       09-26-2011, 10:23 AM Reply   
"log jam" = cheapest fix ever!

glad you got it dialed
Old     (jason95gt)      Join Date: May 2006       09-26-2011, 12:15 PM Reply   
Either way this other prop out performs the 1285 by a long shot for the MCX. When fully weighted it drastically changes the planing time and really helps when turning too.

Reply
Share 

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 3:43 AM.

Home   Articles   Pics/Video   Gear   Wake 101   Events   Community   Forums   Classifieds   Contests   Shop   Search
Wake World Home

 

© 2019 eWake, Inc.    
Advertise    |    Contact    |    Terms of Use    |    Privacy Policy    |    Report Abuse    |    Conduct    |    About Us