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Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Texas       07-31-2016, 3:37 PM Reply   
Totally agree with you Cliff.

Can you believe that the GOP wasted $7 million to create ANOTHER pointless Benghazi report after 8 reports before it already found the same conclusions? Just because they hoped to find something to smear Clinton with. They didn't, of course - but they did blow through millions of your and my money.

Then there was the shutdown the GOP engineered.
"The financial services company Standard & Poors estimated that the shutdown, which lasted just over two weeks, cost $1.5 billion per day, took a total of $24 billion out of the U.S. economy, and shaved 0.6% off fourth-quarter GDP growth.

Here’s a breakdown of some of the economic cost:

About $3.1 billion in lost government services, according to the research firm IHS.

$152 million per day in lost travel spending, according to the U.S. Travel Association.

$76 million per day lost because of National Parks being shut down, according to the National Park Service.

$217 million per day in lost federal and contractor wages in the Washington D.C. metropolitan area alone."



The democrats are no better, but you'd expect the party of fiscal responsibility to actually lead by example instead of by hypocrisy...
Old     (ord27)      Join Date: Oct 2005       07-31-2016, 5:27 PM Reply   
exactly why I say that I am disenfranchised.

but, ideologically, I have to lean republican

Obama came out and said....transform America and redistribute wealth.

no thanks
Old     (ord27)      Join Date: Oct 2005       07-31-2016, 5:32 PM Reply   
I don't look at the "shut down" the same as you apparently do.

If they would get rid of riders and pork......maybe they could agree on something. When each side insists on adding crap to a bill, there is very little that the opposition can do. Both sides were equally responsible for any shut down or ceiling discussion....especially our lack of a leader
Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Texas       07-31-2016, 5:43 PM Reply   
You can believe that, but them ain't the facts sadly. The house did it to try and defund the ACA. This is why we have a senate. The founding fathers knee someday we'd have enough tea party style idiots in the house.
Old     (ord27)      Join Date: Oct 2005       07-31-2016, 5:51 PM Reply   
ok
I don't really care

we need a government that isnt going to waste and isnt going to let people free load

sadly, that concept is probably gone

I had thought that that was what the tea party was supposed to be. The powers that be...on both sides....would never let that happen
Old     (VanillaGorilla)      Join Date: Nov 2015       07-31-2016, 6:06 PM Reply   
"The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not."

Thomas Jefferson

I'm with this guy.

I understand the need for programs and taxation in general but yea, we desperately need to stop the waste and abuse.
Old     (fly135)      Join Date: Jun 2004       07-31-2016, 6:30 PM Reply   
The problem is that 98% of congress doesn't represent you. They represent the other 49 states. Their job is to bring money and programs back to their state and that's what their electorate wants from them. So what 98% of the people think is waste is what 2% want. And every congressman represents the 2%, not the 98%.

What the tea party wants to do is kill a lot of stuff that represents what the govt does for everyone. Not so much the special interests of the state that elects them. The flat tax is a total bulls**t pipe dream. The govt cannot run on a flat tax that's low enough that poor people could pay their share. In the nineties when tax rates were higher, with a wife and two kids I was paying less than 15K a year in fed taxes (not counting fica) on about 125K income and I was banking cash like crazy. Anyone who "claims" to be paying 80K in fed tax should be having a great f**king life and not being a whiny b*tch about paying taxes.
Old     (VanillaGorilla)      Join Date: Nov 2015       07-31-2016, 6:52 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by fly135 View Post
Anyone who "claims" to be paying 80K in fed tax should be having a great f**king life and not being a whiny b*tch about paying taxes.
You're a riot. Don't hate me because my boat has a stereo and yours doesn't....
Old     (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       07-31-2016, 7:14 PM Reply   
I think the arguement is funky funny, the GOP can't believe they're running Trump. Many of you GOP registered cats can't believe you're running Trump. Just becomes us vs. them, roll it. Ugh...our Country is broken.

Whatever, it's what it is...
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       07-31-2016, 7:55 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanillaGorilla View Post
"The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not."

Thomas Jefferson

I'm with this guy.

I understand the need for programs and taxation in general but yea, we desperately need to stop the waste and abuse.
Fake quote, FYI.

https://www.monticello.org/site/jeff...xist-quotation
Old    TheWakeIsReal            07-31-2016, 8:12 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanillaGorilla View Post
"The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not."

Thomas Jefferson

I'm with this guy.

I understand the need for programs and taxation in general but yea, we desperately need to stop the waste and abuse.
For the love of god. Please fact check your quotes. That is one of the most known bullsh*t quotes in history. The date that some right handed nut made up for it was even after his death.
Old    TheWakeIsReal            07-31-2016, 8:17 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanillaGorilla View Post
You're a riot. Don't hate me because my boat has a stereo and yours doesn't....
To be in the 50% tax bracket you would have to be making 10 million a year under Bernie's plan. I hope you would be doing better things than this if you're making 10 mil a year.
Old    TheWakeIsReal            07-31-2016, 8:18 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by markj View Post
Again, sorry you don't get it. There's a MUCH deeper meaning. I'll try to make time to explain it better later or someone else can do it. Surf's up.
I'm still waiting for this MUCH deeper meaning on this horrible quote you brought up.
Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Texas       07-31-2016, 8:19 PM Reply   
It's tough when facts get in the way - kinda like when deficits drop 7 years in a row lol.

John McCain's daughter and others chimed in to help Trump out since he couldn't really think of any of the big sacrifices he claims he's made in comparison to the gold star mother he disgracefully attacked...
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Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Texas       07-31-2016, 8:20 PM Reply   
Guy dodges the draft 5 times and has the narcissistic gall to slam a gold star mom and her sacrifice...
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Old     (ord27)      Join Date: Oct 2005       07-31-2016, 8:22 PM Reply   
calm down wakeisreal

he knows that Jefferson didn't say that, and that he would never have to pay an actual 50%.

it's a reflection of the feeling or fact that the dems are always wanting more.......always

the left is never satisfied

if the right didn't go to extreme measures to fight or argue every leftist point...the fear is that they would take everything and demand everything

get a grip
Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Texas       07-31-2016, 8:38 PM Reply   
Cliff, Grant and others frothed at the mouth on this very forum about how Obama MUST have something to hide otherwise he would have publicly released his birth cert immediately (despite the fact no other Pres has ever done so).

Haven't heard one of you say a thing about Trump refusing to release his tax returns (the irs has confirmed his audit excuse is complete BS). What's he got to hide, and where's your outrage?
Old    TheWakeIsReal            07-31-2016, 8:40 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ord27 View Post
calm down wakeisreal

he knows that Jefferson didn't say that, and that he would never have to pay an actual 50%.

it's a reflection of the feeling or fact that the dems are always wanting more.......always

the left is never satisfied

if the right didn't go to extreme measures to fight or argue every leftist point...the fear is that they would take everything and demand everything

get a grip
How does he know Jefferson didn't say that? He quoted and said nothing of it being false.

He said he would pay 50% under Bernie's plan. So no. He doesn't know that apparently.

You guys go to all ends to make fun of the left, so when you guys state things that are 100% completely false I'm gonna call you on it.
Old     (VanillaGorilla)      Join Date: Nov 2015       08-01-2016, 3:41 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWakeIsReal View Post
For the love of god. Please fact check your quotes. That is one of the most known bullsh*t quotes in history. The date that some right handed nut made up for it was even after his death.
My bad.. Saw it, read it. Didn't check it. Still agree with it.
Old     (VanillaGorilla)      Join Date: Nov 2015       08-01-2016, 3:45 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWakeIsReal View Post
To be in the 50% tax bracket you would have to be making 10 million a year under Bernie's plan. I hope you would be doing better things than this if you're making 10 mil a year.
Don't make anywhere near that kinda dough. Don't have a copy of his tax plan but my understanding was almost 18% drop on my after tax income...
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       08-01-2016, 5:33 AM Reply   
On the taxes front, I read on here a lot along the lines of "if taxes go up, that's socialist and I'm going to quit working and go on the dole myself because I'm not motivated to have the wealth spread around and work hard so others can live off the dole."

And I also read a lot of lamenting for the Reagan years (a time when taxes were higher than they are now).

Is there a time when we were taxed perfectly? When taxes were "just right" in Goldilocks terms? Because we've consistently spent more than we collected since Reagan was elected, with a brief tech bubble exception during the Clinton years.

Even if we slash spending now, we've got 35 years of overspending to contend with. Seems like another good reason to cut taxes?
Old     (VanillaGorilla)      Join Date: Nov 2015       08-01-2016, 5:40 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawndoggy View Post
is there a time when we were taxed perfectly? When taxes were "just right" in goldilocks terms?
1912?
Old     (VanillaGorilla)      Join Date: Nov 2015       08-01-2016, 5:53 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanillaGorilla View Post
1912?
Yall might want to check up on that number.... you know me and fact checking lmao.

Last edited by VanillaGorilla; 08-01-2016 at 6:00 AM.
Old     (VanillaGorilla)      Join Date: Nov 2015       08-01-2016, 6:24 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by pesos View Post
It's tough when facts get in the way - kinda like when deficits drop 7 years in a row lol.

John McCain's daughter and others chimed in to help Trump out since he couldn't really think of any of the big sacrifices he claims he's made in comparison to the gold star mother he disgracefully attacked...
Lol, still stick to it. Double the debt accumulated has to equal double the deficits.

Regarding the Trump and Khan thing... I'm not defending the guy. He could have worded that response much, much better. BUT in comparison to Hillary lying to Sean Smiths mother to her face.... it's a drop in the bucket.
Old     (ord27)      Join Date: Oct 2005       08-01-2016, 7:32 AM Reply   
Wes
I would like to see his tax returns
I would have liked to see Obama's birth certificate and school transcripts

I'm sure that they withhold so as to not give the other side ammo

The outrage, I would bet, is the perception from the right, that there is a double standard. I'm sure that that works both ways as well

Obama, for example, gets a pass in the press, with his secretive administration, even after he promised transparency. A republican President won't get the same pass.

Obama seems to get a pass for his willingness to bypass the checks and balances that are in place within the structure. Republicans dont and wont get the same pass

Hillary gets a pass on being corrupt.......a republican doesn't get the same treatment in the press

Bill got a pass for lying to congress and for his indiscretions .......

write or wrong, accurate statements or not, that's the feeling. So, when a non-democrat does something, it's felt that the party is due....it's our turn
Old     (fly135)      Join Date: Jun 2004       08-01-2016, 8:13 AM Reply   
If Hillary has been getting a pass from the press then how do you know she's corrupt?

You said up above that if Trump released his records that it would just provide opposition with ammunition. If you think about that statement then you might also understand why Hillary is secretive. IOW most if not all of the unsubstantiated crap that conservatives are spewing about Hillary is just the result of political strategy and has nothing to do with addressing the issues or leading the nation.
Old    TheWakeIsReal            08-01-2016, 8:23 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ord27 View Post
Wes
I would like to see his tax returns
I would have liked to see Obama's birth certificate and school transcripts

I'm sure that they withhold so as to not give the other side ammo

The outrage, I would bet, is the perception from the right, that there is a double standard. I'm sure that that works both ways as well

Obama, for example, gets a pass in the press, with his secretive administration, even after he promised transparency. A republican President won't get the same pass.

Obama seems to get a pass for his willingness to bypass the checks and balances that are in place within the structure. Republicans dont and wont get the same pass

Hillary gets a pass on being corrupt.......a republican doesn't get the same treatment in the press

Bill got a pass for lying to congress and for his indiscretions .......

write or wrong, accurate statements or not, that's the feeling. So, when a non-democrat does something, it's felt that the party is due....it's our turn
Man, and they call the liberals the one who always complain and cry foul. You need to go look at all the times Bush passed over congress and the checks/balances in his war on terror. Seriously, go look at the blatant disregard for the constitution during his presidency. It isn't just a problem on the left. And you guys even get mad when Obama does ask for permission, remember this when Obama asked congress for permission to put missiles into Syria? Doubt it.

"Rep. Peter King, a New York Republican, denounced the decision in blunt language: “His failure to act was a woeful abdication of the president’s powers as commander-in-chief and sent the entirely wrong signal to an increasingly dangerous world.”"

So, yeah. Theres that.

You guys just spent 7 million dollars trying to find ANYTHING on Hillary. I mean anything, you probably would have rested on your laurels if you found out she put a plastic bottle in the landfill can of her trash.

There were 15 republican votes of not guilty against Bill between the two charges. Time to let that one go.

So there is no double standard, it's just you guys haven't been in office for 8 years.
Old     (timmyb)      Join Date: Apr 2007       08-01-2016, 8:42 AM Reply   
Birth Certificate?!?! Really? You can Google that and see it. You can then also see the birth announcement in the Hawaii newspaper.
Old     (timmyb)      Join Date: Apr 2007       08-01-2016, 8:49 AM Reply   
It's also not just that the GOP hasn't been in office in 8 years, they have only won the popular vote 1 time since 1992. Remember that Al Gore won the popular vote in 2000 but Bush won the Presidency.
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       08-01-2016, 8:58 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by timmyb View Post
Birth Certificate?!?! Really? You can Google that and see it. You can then also see the birth announcement in the Hawaii newspaper.
Oh like the CIA couldn't go back and change that page in the paper's archives! Get Real!

Old     (ord27)      Join Date: Oct 2005       08-01-2016, 10:56 AM Reply   
calm down guys.

I was just stating that that is more than likely the feeling.

both sides could come up with enough crap to support their claims

all politicians are sheisty

I just tend to oppose the ones that don't have my best interest at heart
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       08-01-2016, 10:58 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ord27 View Post
both sides could come up with enough crap to support their claims
This is totally true. But it's also in your best interest to try to sift through the crap to decide what's true or not rather than picking a side and gobbling that side's crap down as quickly as they can pump it out.
Old     (ord27)      Join Date: Oct 2005       08-01-2016, 11:04 AM Reply   
agreed. If you read most of my posts this year, you will see that I'm somewhat indifferent. In fact, I somewhat fall in the camp that believes that Trump is running, just to ensure a Clinton victory
Old     (allzway)      Join Date: Feb 2014       08-01-2016, 12:31 PM Reply   
I am still not sure who will be more disastrous for the future of the US. Neither Trump or Clinton are fit for the office and still not convinced that Trump isn't just trolling the political process.

Some really scary stories of Hillary are surfacing from the stolen emails that WikiLeaks is starting to post.

Quote:
Julian Assange: So, those Hillary Clinton emails, they connect together with the cables that we have published of Hillary Clinton, creating a rich picture of how Hillary Clinton performs in office, but, more broadly, how the U.S. Department of State operates. So, for example, the disastrous, absolutely disastrous intervention in Libya, the destruction of the Gaddafi government, which led to the occupation of ISIS of large segments of that country, weapons flows going over to Syria, being pushed by Hillary Clinton, into jihadists within Syria, including ISIS, that’s there in those emails. There’s more than 1,700 emails in Hillary Clinton’s collection, that we have released, just about Libya alone.
http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2016...ng-isis-syria/

The mainstream media is so busy protecting her that this isn't seen or heard.

I saw someone post that we needed a GOP president in office so at least the media will report on their transgressions.
Old     (timmyb)      Join Date: Apr 2007       08-01-2016, 12:40 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ord27 View Post
agreed. If you read most of my posts this year, you will see that I'm somewhat indifferent. In fact, I somewhat fall in the camp that believes that Trump is running, just to ensure a Clinton victory
Ok, ok! Sometimes it's hard to get the sarcasm in a post.
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       08-01-2016, 12:40 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by allzway View Post
I am still not sure who will be more disastrous for the future of the US. Neither Trump or Clinton are fit for the office and still not convinced that Trump isn't just trolling the political process.

Some really scary stories of Hillary are surfacing from the stolen emails that WikiLeaks is starting to post.



http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2016...ng-isis-syria/

The mainstream media is so busy protecting her that this isn't seen or heard.

I saw someone post that we needed a GOP president in office so at least the media will report on their transgressions.
Is there an actual link to these communications, rather than people just telling us what other people say the communications allegedly say? I'm not saying you are right or wrong, I just want to see the alleged source documents that form the basis for the assertion.
Old     (allzway)      Join Date: Feb 2014       08-01-2016, 3:13 PM Reply   
Apparently you have to search the wikileaks to find the actual documents.

Assange has a video discussing the emails here.
http://www.democracynow.org/2016/7/2...aks_searchable
Old    TheWakeIsReal            08-01-2016, 3:14 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by allzway View Post

I saw someone post that we needed a GOP president in office so at least the media will report on their transgressions.
Let me get this straight, you honestly think that Fox News wouldn't jump all over any kind of story to slander Hillary? lol, heard it all now. Love this delusional free thinking blogs people follow. Is they have 1700 emails of this stuff released then where is it?
Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Texas       08-01-2016, 3:15 PM Reply   
Exactly. If the GOP is willing to spend $7 million of taxpayer money for a witch hunt, you know they'd be all over this if there was anything of consequence.
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       08-01-2016, 3:17 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by allzway View Post
Apparently you have to search the wikileaks to find the actual documents.
But nobody has actually done that? C'mon, man. If you are saying that there is evidence, please present it.
Old    TheWakeIsReal            08-01-2016, 3:25 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by allzway View Post
Apparently you have to search the wikileaks to find the actual documents.

Assange has a video discussing the emails here.
http://www.democracynow.org/2016/7/2...aks_searchable
Then search em and find em. This sh*t is meaningless with nothing behind it.

I'm gonna make my own blog.

"Freedomthinkertruthopenyoureyes.com"

Found out through the grapevine that trump has sold a nuclear missle to North Korea. Read about it on this blog. That is truth.
Old     (VanillaGorilla)      Join Date: Nov 2015       08-01-2016, 8:16 PM Reply   
Another indicator of the excellence of the last 7 years. Good thing she's campaigning on "4 more years"

http://ww2.cfo.com/the-economy/2016/...1-2-growth-q2/

Another from Forbes..

http://www.forbes.com/sites/stevenbl.../#47246ceaf559

Last edited by VanillaGorilla; 08-01-2016 at 8:23 PM.
Old     (VanillaGorilla)      Join Date: Nov 2015       08-01-2016, 8:28 PM Reply   
One on economic recovery.


http://m.kltv.com/kltv/pm_/contentde...id=od:yQdEkk0W

....and another.

http://www.investors.com/politics/ed...-2-2-trillion/

Oh yeah! I'm still hoping for change...

Last edited by VanillaGorilla; 08-01-2016 at 8:31 PM.
Old     (ord27)      Join Date: Oct 2005       08-01-2016, 10:24 PM Reply   
he is a waste of space. period. history will support my claim
Old    TheWakeIsReal            08-01-2016, 10:33 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanillaGorilla View Post
One on economic recovery.


http://m.kltv.com/kltv/pm_/contentde...id=od:yQdEkk0W

....and another.

http://www.investors.com/politics/ed...-2-2-trillion/

Oh yeah! I'm still hoping for change...
If you're going strictly off GDP then I would say there has been some significant change...Keey trying though!
Attached Images
 
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       08-02-2016, 5:58 AM Reply   
Vanilla -- great posts. You are totally right about our economic recovery being a bit weaksauce.

I mean you guys in Texas have been killing it, but out here in ground zero for the foreclosure crisis, it's only felt like we've made it back to normal in the last couple years.

The difficulty with comparing this recovery to others (especially, say, a post WWII recovery) is the differences in the economy then and now. You've got a much more global economy now, and also one where economies with other major currencies have taken huge hits.

IMHO the President doesn't hold the reins of the economy as much as he rides the bull. Was the gas crisis Carter's fault? Bush I responsible for the S&L meltdown? Clinton's magic responsible for the tech bubble?

This time eight years ago I had the distinctly eerie feeling that the economy had just driven off a cliff. Our local economy had been powered by the housing boom, and by the summer of 08 the foreclosure crisis was starting to build like a tidal wave. Building had shut off by then. And then we saw gas prices spike to $4 a gallon and all of the sudden driving home from work one day it felt like there were about 1/3 the number of cars on the freeway as there had been a couple of months earlier. Then came JP Morgan, AIG, and GM. Kinda felt like the beginning of the next great depression.

I guess I'm saying it coulda turned out worse... a lot worse.
Old     (fly135)      Join Date: Jun 2004       08-02-2016, 7:37 AM Reply   
I like how people seem to think that economic recovery is simply a matter of which President you pick. And it has nothing to do with the behavior of the nation. The depth of analysis is simply looking at some historical averages, as if the economic conditions are exactly the same now as they were after WWII.
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       08-02-2016, 9:59 AM Reply   
Does The Onion question its existence when reality is so absurd?

Trump: 'I always wanted to get the Purple Heart. This was much easier'
http://www.politico.com/story/2016/0...#ixzz4GC9QRFuA

Trump boots baby from Virginia rally
http://www.politico.com/story/2016/0...y-rally-226566

Republican Rep. Richard Hanna will vote for Clinton
http://www.politico.com/story/2016/0...#ixzz4GC9qkeii

(Just from this morning!)
Old     (VanillaGorilla)      Join Date: Nov 2015       08-02-2016, 10:39 AM Reply   
Maybe Trump should have let Bill speak for him if he didn't want to be drafted.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontl...aftletter.html
Old    TheWakeIsReal            08-02-2016, 10:54 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanillaGorilla View Post
Maybe Trump should have let Bill speak for him if he didn't want to be drafted.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontl...aftletter.html
Ahh, yes. This has been a pretty public thing since what? 92? lol. The difference was that Clinton didn't take away heroic status from a POW or slam a soldiers parents. Key differences there.

I think you guys spun rumors of Clinton being involved with the KGB at this time too. Crazy how far things can go when you look back on em eh?
Old     (VanillaGorilla)      Join Date: Nov 2015       08-02-2016, 11:09 AM Reply   
IMO, the DNC used Khan for their political gain. He didn't ask what Hillary had sacrificed or note the fact that she's the one who voted for the war.... They just pushed him to complain about Trumps proposal to halt immigrants from troubled areas. Europe is already suffering the ramifications of refugees committing terroristic acts. I still think better vetting is a wise decision. Oh and the link I posted. I remember when Bill draft dodging was news when he was running for office. Just thought I would post this up for anyone who was too young to remember. The party defended Bill but condemns Trump. Double standard.
Old     (VanillaGorilla)      Join Date: Nov 2015       08-02-2016, 11:15 AM Reply   
No push back from Democrats on this one...

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/06/29/clark.mccain/
Old     (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       08-02-2016, 11:26 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanillaGorilla View Post
IMO, the DNC used Khan for their political gain. He didn't ask what Hillary had sacrificed or note the fact that she's the one who voted for the war.... They just pushed him to complain about Trumps proposal to halt immigrants from troubled areas. Europe is already suffering the ramifications of refugees committing terroristic acts. I still think better vetting is a wise decision. Oh and the link I posted. I remember when Bill draft dodging was news when he was running for office. Just thought I would post this up for anyone who was too young to remember. The party defended Bill but condemns Trump. Double standard.
Well, thank you Captain Obvious for your remark about the DNC using Kahn for "political gain". You don't think the RNC used the mother of one of the soldiers killed in Benghazi for "political gain"? Regardless, Trump was wrong for insulting Kahn's family.
Old    TheWakeIsReal            08-02-2016, 11:29 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanillaGorilla View Post
No push back from Democrats on this one...

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/06/29/clark.mccain/
Did you even read it? He calls him a hero. Just said he is unfit for the job. ?
Old     (VanillaGorilla)      Join Date: Nov 2015       08-02-2016, 11:33 AM Reply   
Watched the interview in full. He said, (paraphrased) "I don't think riding in a jet and being shot down qualifies you to be president".

That's just from memory but it's in the link if you read it all.

For it to be a compliment like you think, it sure pissed off McCain...lol.

Last edited by VanillaGorilla; 08-02-2016 at 11:35 AM.
Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Texas       08-02-2016, 11:34 AM Reply   
Actually, if you're being honest, that's what the INTERVIEWER said (about OBAMA) and he was responding to the interviewers phrase.
Old     (VanillaGorilla)      Join Date: Nov 2015       08-02-2016, 11:41 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by pesos View Post
Actually, if you're being honest, that's what the INTERVIEWER said (about OBAMA) and he was responding to the interviewers phrase.
Yes, Shieffer used the phrase as a compliment to McCain but Clark's response was derogatory.

Schieffer noted that Obama did not have any of those experiences, nor had he "ridden in a fighter plane and gotten shot down."

"Well, I don't think riding in a fighter plane and getting shot down is a qualification to be president," Clark said.
Old     (VanillaGorilla)      Join Date: Nov 2015       08-02-2016, 11:51 AM Reply   
Here's John Kerry saying our soldiers are terrorizing Iraqis...

https://youtu.be/EXaoavV1d4s
Old     (VanillaGorilla)      Join Date: Nov 2015       08-02-2016, 11:55 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wake77 View Post
Well, thank you Captain Obvious for your remark about the DNC using Kahn for "political gain". You don't think the RNC used the mother of one of the soldiers killed in Benghazi for "political gain"? Regardless, Trump was wrong for insulting Kahn's family.
Just to be correct. We didn't lose US soldiers in Benghazi. We lost:

Ambassador Stevens
Information Officer Sean Smith
GSR agent Glen Doherty
GSR agent Tyrone Woods

It was Pat Smith the RNC used for political gain.

None were active military.

Last edited by VanillaGorilla; 08-02-2016 at 11:57 AM.
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       08-02-2016, 12:10 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanillaGorilla View Post
"Well, I don't think riding in a fighter plane and getting shot down is a qualification to be president," Clark said.
Other things that are heroic, but not necessarily qualifiers to be commander in chief:

saving someone from drowning
helping people escape a burning building
taking a bullet for someone else

Saying that one heroic act or another is not a qualifier for commander in cheif is a lot different than comparing one's "sacrifices" as a real estate developer to the sacrifices of a gold star family.
Old     (VanillaGorilla)      Join Date: Nov 2015       08-02-2016, 12:20 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawndoggy View Post
Other things that are heroic, but not necessarily qualifiers to be commander in chief:

saving someone from drowning
helping people escape a burning building
taking a bullet for someone else

Saying that one heroic act or another is not a qualifier for commander in cheif is a lot different than comparing one's "sacrifices" as a real estate developer to the sacrifices of a gold star family.
True about being a hero. Khan asked the question and he responded.

Hillary called Pat Smith a lier but that's not a big deal.

http://dailycaller.com/2016/08/01/hi...rything-video/

http://dailycaller.com/2016/01/07/fa...or-test-video/

Last edited by VanillaGorilla; 08-02-2016 at 12:25 PM.
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       08-02-2016, 12:24 PM Reply   
Vanilla, at this point, what exactly could trump do or say that would make you question your support for him?
Old     (VanillaGorilla)      Join Date: Nov 2015       08-02-2016, 12:27 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawndoggy View Post
Vanilla, at this point, what exactly could trump do or say that would make you question your support for him?
I don't really support him as much as I despise Clinton. I will vote for a can of dog food before her. Not that it really matters since I live Texas.

I just see through all of the media bias.

I wish we could wipe the slate.
Old     (VanillaGorilla)      Join Date: Nov 2015       08-02-2016, 12:30 PM Reply   
As crazy as it will sound coming from me, I agree with Sanders about getting the big money out of politics.
Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Texas       08-02-2016, 1:00 PM Reply   
Now I understand why the Donald is scared to release his tax returns.

I challenge anyone to explain how they could want this person running the country - the sheer number of business failures and bailouts from daddy are incredible:

http://www.newsweek.com/2016/08/12/d...16-486091.html
Old     (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       08-02-2016, 1:21 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanillaGorilla View Post
As crazy as it will sound coming from me, I agree with Sanders about getting the big money out of politics.
When you are just you on here explaining your views on the issues I can see that there's quite a bit of common ground in the middle. All of us are guilty of rooting with our chosen tribe sometimes without a lot of thought (or with a lot of toxic vitriol). But there's a lot more than binds us together than makes us different.
Old     (psudy)      Join Date: Dec 2003       08-02-2016, 1:36 PM Reply   
lol. That wasn't biased.
Old     (VanillaGorilla)      Join Date: Nov 2015       08-02-2016, 1:50 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawndoggy View Post
When you are just you on here explaining your views on the issues I can see that there's quite a bit of common ground in the middle. All of us are guilty of rooting with our chosen tribe sometimes without a lot of thought (or with a lot of toxic vitriol). But there's a lot more than binds us together than makes us different.
Yea, it's a different animal than hanging with folks who all share the same view too. Pretty educational once past the chest thumping/keyboard racing...lol.

Not that I ever stoke the fire.

Last edited by VanillaGorilla; 08-02-2016 at 1:53 PM.
Old    deltahoosier            08-02-2016, 1:50 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by pesos View Post
Now I understand why the Donald is scared to release his tax returns.

I challenge anyone to explain how they could want this person running the country - the sheer number of business failures and bailouts from daddy are incredible:

http://www.newsweek.com/2016/08/12/d...16-486091.html
Don't really see too many hard numbers in regards to numerous bailouts in the article. Sounds more like a sour hit piece at best.

Last I saw Trump has roughly 515 successful companies and 7 failures. I am sure success and failure can be debated in some circles, however the stat is what 80% to 90% of business startups fail. I would say he is pretty good.
Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Texas       08-02-2016, 5:52 PM Reply   
Rod, try this - just put Obama in place of Trump in that article and reread it. Then you'll have plenty to say about the dearth of business acumen lol.


In the meantime, Trump explains the Iran nuclear deal.

"Look, having nuclear—my uncle was a great professor and scientist and engineer, Dr. John Trump at MIT; good genes, very good genes, OK, very smart, the Wharton School of Finance, very good, very smart—you know, if you’re a conservative Republican, if I were a liberal, if, like, OK, if I ran as a liberal Democrat, they would say I'm one of the smartest people anywhere in the world—it’s true!—but when you're a conservative Republican they try—oh, do they do a number—that’s why I always start off: Went to Wharton, was a good student, went there, went there, did this, built a fortune—you know I have to give my like credentials all the time, because we’re a little disadvantaged—but you look at the nuclear deal, the thing that really bothers me—it would have been so easy, and it’s not as important as these lives are (nuclear is powerful; my uncle explained that to me many, many years ago, the power and that was 35 years ago; he would explain the power of what's going to happen and he was right—who would have thought?), but when you look at what's going on with the four prisoners—now it used to be three, now it’s four—but when it was three and even now, I would have said it's all in the messenger; fellas, and it is fellas because, you know, they don't, they haven’t figured that the women are smarter right now than the men, so, you know, it’s gonna take them about another 150 years—but the Persians are great negotiators, the Iranians are great negotiators, so, and they, they just killed, they just killed us."
Old    deltahoosier            08-02-2016, 6:04 PM Reply   
And so? Everybody who gets in business get's startup cash. From family, friends, savings, venture capitalists. I don't really get the point. He knows how to go straight for the throat it appears and does not mess around it appears. I would not say he is a real clear orator when off the cuff, but the guy knows how to negotiate. We did get killed on the Iran deal. They are on their way to the bomb. Trump by the numbers seems to have a really good record of wins compared to losses in the business world. I would compare that to Obama who has more agenda driven losses in my opinion and I can not even speak for Hillary. She is such a rotten evil slime ball......
Old     (ralph)      Join Date: Apr 2002       08-02-2016, 10:03 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deltahoosier View Post
And so? Everybody who gets in business get's startup cash. From family, friends, savings, venture capitalists. I don't really get the point. He knows how to go straight for the throat it appears and does not mess around it appears. I would not say he is a real clear orator when off the cuff, but the guy knows how to negotiate. We did get killed on the Iran deal. They are on their way to the bomb. Trump by the numbers seems to have a really good record of wins compared to losses in the business world. I would compare that to Obama who has more agenda driven losses in my opinion and I can not even speak for Hillary. She is such a rotten evil slime ball......
I pretty much agree with all that, the only thing I would highlight is when you screw up in business you go broke, when you screw up in international affairs you go to war and people die. At the end of the day you have the choice between a loud mouth and a snake. The two party system is awesome.
Old     (pesos)      Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Texas       08-02-2016, 10:16 PM Reply   
I would also add that the point is more that he claims over and over ad nauseous to be a "self made man." The chronic narcissism and lying is more an issue than the silver spoon he was born with up his azz...
Old     (doublemwa)      Join Date: May 2016       08-03-2016, 6:06 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deltahoosier View Post
And so? Everybody who gets in business get's startup cash. From family, friends, savings, venture capitalists. I don't really get the point. He knows how to go straight for the throat it appears and does not mess around it appears. I would not say he is a real clear orator when off the cuff, but the guy knows how to negotiate. We did get killed on the Iran deal. They are on their way to the bomb. Trump by the numbers seems to have a really good record of wins compared to losses in the business world. I would compare that to Obama who has more agenda driven losses in my opinion and I can not even speak for Hillary. She is such a rotten evil slime ball......
Agreed, I took out a straight loans with my start-up. However, trumps cash came with no strings attached. That makes a big difference. Not to mention, when the Taj in Atlantic City was going under his dad bought $3.5M of chips to inject cash into the business.

The problem is Trump thinks he can negotiate things that are non-negotiable. For example the interest on the loans taken out with the Taj as collateral or US Debt that is sold as Guaranteed Bonds. The simple mention of negotiating the value of US Bonds will crush our debt structure. Subsequently, crashing the domestic economy. For someone who believes in trickle down economics, you should be able to understand that.

What do you think is wrong with the Iran deal? It was bi-partisan joint effort that included 7 other nations.
Old    TheWakeIsReal            08-03-2016, 8:38 AM Reply   
The right will shut this down soon.

http://www.13newsnow.com/news/snoop-...cert/282686798
Old    deltahoosier            08-03-2016, 9:55 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by doublemwa View Post
Agreed, I took out a straight loans with my start-up. However, trumps cash came with no strings attached. That makes a big difference. Not to mention, when the Taj in Atlantic City was going under his dad bought $3.5M of chips to inject cash into the business.

The problem is Trump thinks he can negotiate things that are non-negotiable. For example the interest on the loans taken out with the Taj as collateral or US Debt that is sold as Guaranteed Bonds. The simple mention of negotiating the value of US Bonds will crush our debt structure. Subsequently, crashing the domestic economy. For someone who believes in trickle down economics, you should be able to understand that.

What do you think is wrong with the Iran deal? It was bi-partisan joint effort that included 7 other nations.
There is zero difference if the money was given or loaned. You still have to succeed. Difference is a person who does not have to worry about the amount can wheel, deal and roll the dice with less stress. I am ok with that. I will never be in that position. I am going to be lucky to not hand my family a bill when I die. I will consider that a win compared to where my family was able to start me.

Everything is negotiable. That is a big lie we tell ourselves. Not that I am good at it mind you, however these are all rules we put in the sand. What Trump is getting at is China is widely known to be under valuing their money. Thus the US debt is higher to them. Part of the strategy is for America to print more and more money to devalue our currency to actually lessen our debt load if I understand it correctly. Or you do what Trump says and you renegotiate the debt with China.

Yes I believe in trickle down economics from the aspect that free money in the economy is what allows second tier and third tier businesses capture fundss Keynesian economics or trickle up is what we had during the Clinton years leading to the Bush years with the housing crash. Money was made available to the poorer people to get home loans. That increased demand but also increase volatility. Eventually the poor people are priced out of the market again. Now middle class people can not afford a house. It takes a mixture of the two and depends where you are in the country. Small town America I think is classic trickle down. Usually propped up by a couple major employers. The poor to middle class have no leverage to drive anything economically. If the major businesses leave, the town dies. Places like the bay area of California that gets money hand over fist from all over the world, you can drive markets from the top and bottom. That is why the local governments get in on the act. They raise taxes higher and higher because they can. The money is there.

Here is an article among many on the Iran deal:

http://www.businessinsider.com/heres...an-deal-2015-7

Basically Iran is being allowed to produce it's own fuel which basically gives them a nuclear bomb in short order. They absolutely support terrorist organizations and we are giving them a free pass to be the premier power in the middle east. Why not give Iraq that direction?
Old     (fly135)      Join Date: Jun 2004       08-03-2016, 10:40 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deltahoosier View Post
Why not give Iraq that direction?
We did. Iraq used to be Iran's mortal enemy. Now it's just a matter of time until they are bosom buddies.
Old    deltahoosier            08-03-2016, 1:20 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by fly135 View Post
We did. Iraq used to be Iran's mortal enemy. Now it's just a matter of time until they are bosom buddies.
Well. That is a problem and I agree. Iran has too much influence in Iraq. I guess this goes to show that sometimes it is best to let tyrants reign when the alternative is opening the gates of hell to the peaceful people on earth.
Old    TheWakeIsReal            08-03-2016, 2:33 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by deltahoosier View Post
Well. That is a problem and I agree. Iran has too much influence in Iraq. I guess this goes to show that sometimes it is best to let tyrants reign when the alternative is opening the gates of hell to the peaceful people on earth.
No sh*t. But your messiah W Bush destroyed the region. Papa bush knew better.

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED
Old    deltahoosier            08-03-2016, 3:59 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWakeIsReal View Post
No sh*t. But your messiah W Bush destroyed the region. Papa bush knew better.

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED
My such a hateful little response. My messiah is Jesus Christ bud.

I can post up the letters from all the democrats from Hillary, Bill, Gore and the rest stating publicly that we needed to get rid of Saddam. Even the leftists said we have the receipt from the gas we sold Saddam but of course that meme died quickly since it. I am never happy to send troops into a war zone, but if we had to try and straighten things out I would rather it be there and not here. So that place is screwed up and Obama wants to invite them all here.

Hey did you guys read about the wiki leaks about Hillary running guns and heavy arms to Syrian Rebels to destabilize Syria and that they ultimately joined ISIS? I guess that was the whole Bengahzi thing. The actual American Embassy was in Tripoli. This was a gun running operation from Hillary. Interesting stuff. I thought she swore under oath that she did not know anything about it? Going to be interesting.....
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