SOVEN WINS again!!!!

Sorry but that kid rips. Tour stop 1 = his. Check out prowakeboardtour.com for the results.

One of the best Pro finals ever!!! All four riders rode awesome. I really like the new scoring format. Congrats to Phillip he killed it, & to JD for a solid 2nd place finish.

Here is his winning run...http://videos.wakeboardingmag.com/viewVideo.php?video_id=1013&title=Phillip_Sovens_W inning_Run_at_Pro_Tour_Stop_One&vpkey=ad6bc326b0

crappy conditions and i congrats to those that can still throw down in that crap!!!!

It is amazing how short of cuts he takes and gets amazing pop.

that wake looks crazy big

I was thinking the same thing nick.

That x-star must be loaded.

We had to leave, but it was a good day. It was very windy and I thought that all the sponsor banners that they had in the middle of the beach near the waterline (the prime place to watch the riding from) were distracting and you couldn't see much of the riding because of them. Congrats to Soven.

Was he riding a shorter line than normal? I know the Pro's have skills but with the longer lines these days you don't normally see them going into the flats with drifting only a 5 foot long edge.

Wow, he was riding extra smooth

Hey,

Phillip is such a good contest rider a machine. maybe this new format might help some rider that just dont quite have what it takes to win a competition. New format or not doing hs5's or bs180's into the flats doesnt push the level of riding. What does it really prove.

Fred, you aren't going to win the tournament just doing a big five or bs 180 in the flats. Those are more spacer/style tricks that just help the flow of the run. As you could see by all of their runs, the most technical (although i thought JD should have won) took it. Phillip threw in his standard bag of tricks and then threw in some stuff that he normally would not do. The tail glide to fakie (maybe stale can't remember) was way cooler than him just throwing in a different variation of a 7 or 9 out of his bag, and I don't know if you have tried that trick, but it is actually VERY HARD. I thought it was awesome riding by the riders

Hi,

yeah definately the tail or stale glide to fakie was good, but putting hs5;s and bs180's as filler tricks or part of your run because this is what the new format requires is not pushing the sport forward. Competition is supposed to push the sport.
I have a sneaking suspision that this format was introduced in Australia to help out the riders that couldnt quite make the podium. You guys need to watch the run between phillip and Dean Smith at the Carribbean gardens stop in Australia.
Phillip was robbed it was a disgrace, the judges clearly put Dean Smith across the line, when Phillips run was far better than dean smiths.

I saw that Fred, I don't know how dean won that

wakeboarding should not be pushed by competition. wakeboarding should be pushed by innovation and style.

Friendly competition where tricks incorporate innovation and style!
Now everyones happy.

Hi,

friendly competition mmmmmm is there such a thing as friendly competition I dont think so in a perfect world maybe.
Unfortunately competition does push the sport, how else would you gauge who is good and who isnt.
Competition is about who is the best at doing these tricks you see, that the average rider cant do. How do you think these guys get that good, by pushing themselves to take their tricks to that next degree.doing bs 180's into the flats doesnt really push the technical side or element of doing spins or mobes to that next level.
And to those that think that the sport should be more like snow boarding, how can it be. They are 2 different sports the only similarity is that you ride a board, one is towed by a rope the other you go down hill on your own.
Dont get me wrong I appreciate a nice floaty bs 180 into the flats it looks good. I really believe this format was bought in to help those who could not cut the grade. This format will change competition whether it is good or bad is a matter of opinion.

Fred, I disagree and think the new format does push the sport. I think the riders even had a meeting to see how they wanted the format. Judging is tough though it seems like. Most people think Randall Harris and Keith Lyman are two of the best wakeboarders so why not set up the judging based on thier riding than a rider like Froggy. This format works for froggy though because he crams tricks in rides a short rope and goes slow it looks like. Congrats for froggy for winning but imagine of Randall won how many posts would be on here. Its boring watching the same exact winning run for 5 years now

IMO the old system unduly rewarded sketchy hucked riding, he with the most mobes wins, it doesn't matter how good they look or how big they are. It reminds me a bit of trick skiing.

The new system demands a more balanced approach where you have to have all types of wake and rail riding down, Tech, spin, big air & slide. Plus an overall which covers how your riding looks, how long you grab, & how big you go.

I think the new system will drive the sport forward to something which people actually want to watch rather than a hole bunch of mobes that looks the same to 90% of people watching.

Who are you Fred? Come out from behind your pseudonym.

Maybe people are sick of soven winning, its time that others stepped upto this level and not the other way around. OK so you set the riding up to suit Lyman and Harris where do you see it going from there. push the sport in a direction of just going big on hs or ts 5's or big on bs180's then that will make everybody more even in competition. Wakeboarding is nothing like trick skiing either, in one respect some of you are trying to dictate what tricks should be done just like trick skiing. Trick skiing you are only allowed to do certain tricks in your pass.
You agree that that systems sucks, but it is alright for this new format to dictate to riders that they need to do big tricks into the flats and lets get rid of the technical side. this excludes riders from doing lots of spins and mobes.
I read a post somewhere and someone said that they were tired of seeing tootsie rolls being thrown by Pro wakeboarders at events as a fill in trick. IMO opinion the new system unduly rewards riders that dont quite have the technical side down and need the big air tricks to get them through.

I sense some trouble 'a brewin.

Real quik I thought I'd say that there are certain categories for progression of the sport [IMO] I don't know what to call it but the first one is the biggest spin/flip/mobe ie 1080, tempertantrum, crow mobe 7 [I hear someone was close]. Another is style, what flows with what to make this or that look cool/going big, landing smooth, another one is making wakeboarding more popular, the more the marrier. Thus, Fred, by my definition of wakeboard progression I have to say I disagree, although my riding style is really sketchy. Mobes are not the most difficult tricks in wakeboarding, thus, a point-system that saysso is inaccurate.

Edit: P.S. welcome to wakeworld...

(Message edited by hawk7 on May 25, 2008)

what?

looking back that doesn't really make sense...

Fred, are you sure you understand the new system? If a rider can't do high level spins and mobes they won't win those categories so are extremely unlikely to win the heat or final.

Fred i was the person who posted about tootsie rolls in competition......

I just hope you know that Sovens Glide to Fakie would be about 10 times harder than a tootsie roll.

The new system wasn't created to slow down progression, but more to ensure that the winning riders were competent in all areas of our sport.

People have said it before the same riders will probably keep winning for awhile longer, but the contest runs look a lot better with the new format IMO!

No, Fred is right, we need more ungrabbed crow 5's. That's wakeboarding right there.

An ungrabbed crow 5 looks better than a bs 180.

I am fine with anyone winning as long as it is good to watch. In the last few years I have been to the nationals in wisconsin and indy, and stops in detroit. I am surprised that the crowd keep getting smaller. Honestly, I think the event was more fun in 1997 when I went then it is now. Passes were time and ropes were short but at least the riders then would CUT AT THE WAKE. I am not saying at all that the riders dont have skills and it is clear from video parts that the certainly can launch when they arent in a contest. I am saying that the format prior to this year did not account AT ALL for amplitude. I think the tech tricks are awesome but i dont know why almost NOBODY lands past the downwake on any trick in the past few years on the pro tour. Please dont tell me it is because the lines have gotten longer since i remember people going bigger a few years ago because the wake has also gotten a whole lot bigger too. When I was at nationals a few years ago the shoreline was the most crowded all weekend to watch randy harris actually cut at the wake and land in the flats. He fell twice and i think he made 2 tricks and it was the run I enjoyed watching the most out of the whole weekend, lyman was a close 2nd. I think you should definitely reward what brings people out to see the riders and unfortunately that isnt all small intricate tricks know matter how tech. To respond to the last post above, even better for me than a big BS 180 or a crow 5 would be a BIG CROW 5. bottom line is get more people on the shoreline or it isnt going to matter what scoring system we use.

Drew, the PWT hasen't been to Detroit or Indy since 2003, a lot has changed, as far as crowds go, Wake Games and Atlanta had huges crowds this year, as far as people landing stuff wake to wake, some tricks need to be landed that way, the new scoreing system is going to work out just fine, the riders just need a little time to figure out what the judges are looking for. The Jr Mens & Pro Men's finals at Atlanta was the best I have every seen, and I've seen a few.

i like the fact that they have both formats.

sure phillip is winning a lot of contests, but its not like phillip is the only good contest rider. i think rusty and dean are stepping up their consistency. for example i remember phillip beat rusty with a backside 7 and rusty tried a 10 and fell. not too long ago rusty not to long ago beat phillip with a backside 7. i would much rather watch someone with consistency then watch someone that goes huge and falls a lot. or if you have consistency and go huge. even better. but thats just my 2 cents

As people have stated these good riders will be able to do basic tricks into the flats, wow! it would be very hard to land tech tricks into the flats.
Would have been good to see the mens and jnr mens finals in atlanta.
How good were both finals, what happened, could someone fill me in with details

thanks

randy, i went to nationals the last few years too. maybe its the location, but it just didnt seem like anyone was there.

Fred, Dave Williams has a video of the Acworth pro men's finals on the wakeworld home page that Austin Hair shot, check it out.

Drew, yeah the national crowd did seam a little light last year, might be because they had it four days after the Twin Cites stop, only about 5 hours apart might have split the crowds maybe.

I think the new format is great. I was at the wake games and acworth and the competition is not friendly as someone said earlier in this post. I think some of you guys are like girls and you like the drama. its like you're looking for something wrong in this new format. D.R.I.V.E. format...read the last wake mag and it explains. randall and lyman can do all the backside 180's they want to. They can get some legit points for that category. but if randall doesn't deliver on his fat chance and slim chance mobes then he's out. Thats how he made it to the semifinals. Its all about variety. if soven only does his skeezer 5's and whirly5's and doesn't throw in a backside 180 that looks real stylish then he missed a big percentage of the score. in the finals for the wake games...rusty won because he matched soven's skeezer 5 plus he landed a heel back 7 off the d-up...plus a huge melon grab and a back 180. so the runs were almost the same except for the double up. In acworth rusty was flawless but he could only do the switch crow mobe (skeezer) and didnt match sovens skeezer 5 or whirly 5. Thats why soven won. also Webb did the 9 off the d-up and thats why he beat rusty for 2nd. If soven would have not done a batwing to fakie or his melon 180..he could have slipped out because he lacked variety. the scoring just hits on so many other areas. its not about who it fits. if randall could have a flawless run and throw a mobe to a 5 or land a 9 off the d-up then he would be in the finals. but just some back 180's and 5's in the flats or as someone called it (fill tricks) lol...won't get you into the finals. Respect this sport. When you post something on here try not to be so negative and look for all thats wrong.When ur posting, keep in mind that this is on the internet and anyone(including people who are just getting into the sport) can get on here and look at what wakeboarding represents and what we talk about. Sometimes I think this discussion board makes wakeboarders look like whiney little girls.