TRUMP for Prez

Originally Posted by deltahoosier

Did you read the article? It literally said everything I just said about the situation. Ayers did participate in early bombings Only reason they got off was by the way the evidence was collected (technicality) and Obama did do a meet and greet in Ayer's home. It is right there in the article.

Yes it did say all those things, but i think the reality was summed up by Ayers himself:
The dishonesty of the narrative about Mr. Obama during the campaign went a step further with its assumption that if you can place two people in the same room at the same time, or if you can show that they held a conversation, shared a cup of coffee, took the bus downtown together or had any of a thousand other associations, then you have demonstrated that they share ideas, policies, outlook, influences and, especially, responsibility for each other’s behavior. There is a long and sad history of guilt by association in our political culture, and at crucial times we’ve been unable to rise above it.

The same thing is going on now with Trump and Russia, is there anything more there? Probably not but there are issues around Trumps truthfulness and inability to get the job done while being distracted by drama that swirls around him.

Ok riddle me this: how can your Healthcare be so poor when you spend so much money?

In NZ the "Free system" costs $2,800 per person (from tax, not user pays), the "Premium system" available with insurance $3,700 per person. To give you an idea of the level of service, my wife had breast cancer 3 years ago, got diagnosed, treated and reconstructed within 1 week (we have insurance). Strangely my best mates wife had the same 18 months later and got the same procedure under the free system, taking 3 weeks. Service and level of care was amazing under both systems.

In the US the cost is $4,200 per person for the free system (reportedly hopeless) and $9,000 for the system supported by insurance.

Keep in mind NZ is a nation of 4 million people, with scale of economies the US system should be cheaper per person not more expensive!

The problem with the US Healthcare system is not money it is inefficiency and cost distortion caused by your political system. Both republicans and Democrats are letting you down.

Originally Posted by ralph

Yes it did say all those things, but i think the reality was summed up by Ayers himself:
The dishonesty of the narrative about Mr. Obama during the campaign went a step further with its assumption that if you can place two people in the same room at the same time, or if you can show that they held a conversation, shared a cup of coffee, took the bus downtown together or had any of a thousand other associations, then you have demonstrated that they share ideas, policies, outlook, influences and, especially, responsibility for each other’s behavior. There is a long and sad history of guilt by association in our political culture, and at crucial times we’ve been unable to rise above it.

The same thing is going on now with Trump and Russia, is there anything more there? Probably not but there are issues around Trumps truthfulness and inability to get the job done while being distracted by drama that swirls around him.

Ayers himself? Wow. You are taking the word of a known marxist who is a domestic terrorist who is dedicated to taking down the American political system? That guy? Look man. You just do not end up in some guys house to kick off a presidential campaign. There is zero accidents in politics at that level.

Originally Posted by fly135

No. He's been tin hatting for some time. It's crazy to even bring up Ayres in the context of a president that murdered 10s of thousands of Americans over nothing more than lies. Not to mention murdering maybe a million impoverished peasants.

So why didn't the democrats stop the war when they had the power of the purse? Why did Obama continue the wars for his entire presidency even though he was against the war? Why was Obama flinging around drone strikes everywhere if he was against the war? Didn't he get a Nobel Prize for Peace?

Actions do not equal the narrative.

Originally Posted by ralph

We have a mixed model here with govt run and funded hospitals and also private alternatives which sit at a higher price point, supported with insurance. It allows the consumer a choice with a safety net which sits below for everyone. It's not perfect, there are some issues but the system works pretty well with reasonable burden placed on the tax payer and reasonable care provided for 95% of the population. The difference here is we don't allow lobbing so we don't get big industries manipulating politicians directly. I'm sure the "farmac" model wouldn't fly with the drug industry power there.

We do to. We have county hospitals. My wife had a couple surgeries done there when she was young. What it is, people do not want to go there so they want to bring down the people who choose less money for jobs to gain better benefits. You have all these self employeed people who don't want to pay the big money for private insurance but don't want to go to county with the common people.

You say yours i cheap. Do you pay for your doctors and nurses to go to school? We don't. Can you sue your doctor or nurse for millions? We can. Cancer is one thing. How long does it take if you blow our your knee or tear a ligament in your thumb? People here can be in and out in a couple weeks after the swelling is down.

Originally Posted by deltahoosier

Ayers himself? Wow. You are taking the word of a known marxist who is a domestic terrorist who is dedicated to taking down the American political system? That guy? Look man. You just do not end up in some guys house to kick off a presidential campaign. There is zero accidents in politics at that level.

I'm confused why you keep perpetuating this lie? There was a coffee fundraiser held at the Ayers' house (among a dozen or so other houses in the neighborhood) in 1995 at the request of the former state senator as he was getting ready for Obama to run to take over that position. This was 13 years before the 2008 election and had nothing to do with running for president...?

Originally Posted by pesos

I'm confused why you keep perpetuating this lie? There was a coffee fundraiser held at the Ayers' house (among a dozen or so other houses in the neighborhood) in 1995 at the request of the former state senator as he was getting ready for Obama to run to take over that position. This was 13 years before the 2008 election and had nothing to do with running for president...?

Hilary had those questions too if you read up on it. Point is, Obama and company keep hanging and supporting radicals and leftist agendas. There has been unfettered protests and violence during Obama's presidency. He supports that type of activism. It is also in line with marxist idealogy.

Originally Posted by deltahoosier

Actions do not equal the narrative.

I wish it would. I was talking about a dem president murdering Americans. My issue is with policy not party. You don't get a pass with bad policy because of party. Did not think Obama did a good job with Syria.

Why no comment on the DNC IT guy and the well known fact that the DNC claimed they were hacked by Russians, did not let the FBI prove it, and now have a Pakastan (sp?) IT guy who was just busted by the FBI on staff? Hmmmmm...... I wonder how those documents got out? oh.....that's right..... the Russians did it

The reason I don't comment or am all up in hillarys biz is because...The way I understand it the Russians interfered and tried to get trump elected because they assumed he would be more Russian friendly. Trumps actions appear to corroborate that, in fact congess just passed and trump signed (under pressure) a bill taking away trumps power to reduce russias sanctions. Why did bipartisan senate handcuff trump? They obviously do not trust him. There are 2 bipartisan bills in the works so that trump cannot make an in recess appointment in order to fire Mueller. Again, why? Dems and Repubs cannot trust trump. So, since the Russians attempted to assist trump in getting elected why investigate the loser, the person not in power, and not assumed to have been assisted by the Russians. I think it would be good debate to discuss if the Russians actions actually had an effect on actual voting or result. Believe it or not, if Mueller during his investigation finds damaging Clinton info, I believe he will act on it. She and DNC were under a 1 year investigation by the FBI, they did not find enough to prosecute. It seems to me to be simple common sense to investigate trump as opposed to Clinton/DNC.
Be educated on your choice and who you hitch your wagon to. Remember, politics is NOT religion, your beliefs should not be based on simple blind faith. The church of sean Hannity can lead you into trouble.
Did you see trump W.V speech/rally last night? lie after lie and desperately trying to keep hold of his floundering base. I do not know if he will get caught on the Russian collusion or even obstruction. He may end up being prosecuted for tax evasion. The Clinton impeachment was all started by the Whitewater investigation. Clinton perjured himself in the grand jury testimony. Clinton was a Rhodes scholar and a yale law school grad and lawyer....AND he perjured himself. From Whitewater to Monica Lewinski to perjury. Mueller is going back 10 years on trumps RE deals and finances. There are no defense lawyers at a grand jury. Trump could really hang himself. Heck, while questioned by a friendly Lester Holt on nat'l tv he admitted to firing comey because of the Russia thing. ouch.

Originally Posted by deltahoosier

You say yours i cheap. Do you pay for your doctors and nurses to go to school? We don't. Can you sue your doctor or nurse for millions? We can. Cancer is one thing. How long does it take if you blow our your knee or tear a ligament in your thumb? People here can be in and out in a couple weeks after the swelling is down.

No Drs and nurses pay their own way, they get an interest free loan to fund it but they cover the costs and repay once they start employment.

No, we can't sue for damages in medical misadventure or accident, we have "ACC" here which is like a state run insurance system which covers you for loss of income and rehabilitation. Drs still get held to account for performance by the health authority but you can't sure them for damages. The problem with being able to sue is all that happens is drs take insurance and the cost is just put back on the consumer.

For non urgent surgery there is no delay in the private system, public system the delays can be long depending on how debilitating the injury is, 3 months for a knee not unusual.

Sounds like you think the way your Healthcare system works is great, you must be 1/250 million, ha ha.

Originally Posted by deltahoosier

Hilary had those questions too if you read up on it. Point is, Obama and company keep hanging and supporting radicals and leftist agendas. There has been unfettered protests and violence during Obama's presidency. He supports that type of activism. It is also in line with marxist idealogy.

Why do you keep perpetuating this lie (among others)?

Originally Posted by ralph

No Drs and nurses pay their own way, they get an interest free loan to fund it but they cover the costs and repay once they start employment.

No, we can't sue for damages in medical misadventure or accident, we have "ACC" here which is like a state run insurance system which covers you for loss of income and rehabilitation. Drs still get held to account for performance by the health authority but you can't sure them for damages. The problem with being able to sue is all that happens is drs take insurance and the cost is just put back on the consumer.

For non urgent surgery there is no delay in the private system, public system the delays can be long depending on how debilitating the injury is, 3 months for a knee not unusual.

Sounds like you think the way your Healthcare system works is great, you must be 1/250 million, ha ha.

Delta blindly supports a party that is fighting hard to put limits on the amount doctors can be sued in cases of malpractice. Don't let him fool you.

Republicans long criticized the flaws in the US Healthcare system; that is, before Obamacare passed. Now it was the greatest system on the planet. They had 7 years to come up with some sort of sensible replacement. Nothing.

Trump starts his own news show called "Real news", ha ha Straight from Goebbels play book, Fox news not biased enough for him?

Originally Posted by pesos

Why do you keep perpetuating this lie (among others)?

Because it is true. You not watching the news? How many protests and burned down cites there has to be?

You repeatedly (knowingly?) lie claiming Obama "kicked off his 2008 presidential campaign" in Ayers' living room when the coffee fundraiser in question (one of many in that neighborhood) was 13 years earlier in 1995. Why do you keep lying, Rod?

Originally Posted by wake77

Delta blindly supports a party that is fighting hard to put limits on the amount doctors can be sued in cases of malpractice. Don't let him fool you.

Republicans long criticized the flaws in the US Healthcare system; that is, before Obamacare passed. Now it was the greatest system on the planet. They had 7 years to come up with some sort of sensible replacement. Nothing.

I support common sense and truth. The truth is, lawsuits costs get returned to the consumer. The threat of it drives costs. That is a simple economic truth.

Not so sure Republicans were complaining about healthcare as much as participating in the discussion. If people are complaining about costs and you have to defend it by explaining the shortcomings, you can claim it is complaining all you want.

Personally, I stand to gain from taxing the people more to pay for healthcare. I have always taken a job that had benefits thus lower salary than those around me doing similar work. As someone who grew up with out insurance, it was important to me. With that said, care was pretty cheap because people where I grew up did not have insurance so you did not have these deep pockets to be exploited. Just like credit cards have allowed product prices to sky rocket, health insurance has allowed the cost to sky rocket. You are starting to see it even in animal care.

For me. It would help me to the highest level by taking money out of the economy that I have to compete with for products. However, I can look at something and say this is not right in general. Unlike democrats who love the classic line "you are stupid for voting against your own best interests", I can look at situations and say this is best for everyone even if it does not help me.

Originally Posted by pesos

You repeatedly (knowingly?) lie claiming Obama "kicked off his 2008 presidential campaign" in Ayers' living room when the coffee fundraiser in question (one of many in that neighborhood) was 13 years earlier in 1995. Why do you keep lying, Rod?

Because I want to be a democrat Wes.

Copout, liar.

Originally Posted by ralph

No Drs and nurses pay their own way, they get an interest free loan to fund it but they cover the costs and repay once they start employment.

No, we can't sue for damages in medical misadventure or accident, we have "ACC" here which is like a state run insurance system which covers you for loss of income and rehabilitation. Drs still get held to account for performance by the health authority but you can't sure them for damages. The problem with being able to sue is all that happens is drs take insurance and the cost is just put back on the consumer.

For non urgent surgery there is no delay in the private system, public system the delays can be long depending on how debilitating the injury is, 3 months for a knee not unusual.

Sounds like you think the way your Healthcare system works is great, you must be 1/250 million, ha ha.

Here they have to get interest loans that are not dischargable in bankruptcy. We could not wait for 3 months for surgery. That would be unacceptable. That is why many from socialized medicine love to fly to the US for procedures.

Originally Posted by pesos

Copout, liar.

democrat terrorist

Originally Posted by pesos

Copout, liar.

Why do you support groups that burn and loot cities? Why do you defend and support culture that murders the citizens of the democrat cities? Why wont your acknowledge the BLM, ANTIFA and others are democrat fabrications.

Nowhere have I done those things (outside of your fantasy Roddyworld). You have lied repeatedly here for everyone to see and appear to be proud of it.

Originally Posted by 95sn

The reason I don't comment or am all up in hillarys biz is because...The way I understand it the Russians interfered and tried to get trump elected because they assumed he would be more Russian friendly. Trumps actions appear to corroborate that, in fact congess just passed and trump signed (under pressure) a bill taking away trumps power to reduce russias sanctions. Why did bipartisan senate handcuff trump? They obviously do not trust him. There are 2 bipartisan bills in the works so that trump cannot make an in recess appointment in order to fire Mueller. Again, why? Dems and Repubs cannot trust trump. So, since the Russians attempted to assist trump in getting elected why investigate the loser, the person not in power, and not assumed to have been assisted by the Russians. I think it would be good debate to discuss if the Russians actions actually had an effect on actual voting or result. Believe it or not, if Mueller during his investigation finds damaging Clinton info, I believe he will act on it. She and DNC were under a 1 year investigation by the FBI, they did not find enough to prosecute. It seems to me to be simple common sense to investigate trump as opposed to Clinton/DNC.
Be educated on your choice and who you hitch your wagon to. Remember, politics is NOT religion, your beliefs should not be based on simple blind faith. The church of sean Hannity can lead you into trouble.
Did you see trump W.V speech/rally last night? lie after lie and desperately trying to keep hold of his floundering base. I do not know if he will get caught on the Russian collusion or even obstruction. He may end up being prosecuted for tax evasion. The Clinton impeachment was all started by the Whitewater investigation. Clinton perjured himself in the grand jury testimony. Clinton was a Rhodes scholar and a yale law school grad and lawyer....AND he perjured himself. From Whitewater to Monica Lewinski to perjury. Mueller is going back 10 years on trumps RE deals and finances. There are no defense lawyers at a grand jury. Trump could really hang himself. Heck, while questioned by a friendly Lester Holt on nat'l tv he admitted to firing comey because of the Russia thing. ouch.

I don't know if Trump would be better for Russia considering Hilary's foundations were lining their pockets with Russian money for her pushing uranium sales their way.

I don't watch Hannity or others. I don't want politics or news. I watch sports at best.

As far as congress not working with Trump. That is easy. He is not their guy. Trump was never supposed to win the Republican nomination. They are pissed about it. They are all dirty. The Democrats and Republicans are a little to similar in certain believes. I said from the beginning that Obama Care is a huge corporate give away. Why would the Republicans want to change it. It would have been changed though if not for McCain.

Clinton did screw himself and yet they love to say Republicans are at a war against women. Clinton lied about women when sued. He basically got away with it.

Originally Posted by pesos

Nowhere have I done those things (outside of your fantasy Roddyworld). You have lied repeatedly here for everyone to see and appear to be proud of it.

What have I lied about. So Obama did not start his actual campaign in 2008 in his house but we are going to dance around that Obama has ties to Ayers and how that is? Really? That is a lie huh. Why does it bother you that Obama would be tied to Ayers? Don't like the democrats true roots to be on display? Don't want to be associated with police station bombers? How about city burner downers? How about cop shooters?

Originally Posted by deltahoosier

I support common sense and truth. The truth is, lawsuits costs get returned to the consumer. The threat of it drives costs. That is a simple economic truth.

Not so sure Republicans were complaining about healthcare as much as participating in the discussion. If people are complaining about costs and you have to defend it by explaining the shortcomings, you can claim it is complaining all you want.

Personally, I stand to gain from taxing the people more to pay for healthcare. I have always taken a job that had benefits thus lower salary than those around me doing similar work. As someone who grew up with out insurance, it was important to me. With that said, care was pretty cheap because people where I grew up did not have insurance so you did not have these deep pockets to be exploited. Just like credit cards have allowed product prices to sky rocket, health insurance has allowed the cost to sky rocket. You are starting to see it even in animal care.

For me. It would help me to the highest level by taking money out of the economy that I have to compete with for products. However, I can look at something and say this is not right in general. Unlike democrats who love the classic line "you are stupid for voting against your own best interests", I can look at situations and say this is best for everyone even if it does not help me.

That is part of the "truth". The other part of the "truth" is that doctors sometimes screw up and maybe, just maybe they cause damage in excess of proposed caps.

What world are you living in where you believe "credit cards cause product prices to sky rocket"? And you are way off base believing health insurance caused massive increases to health-care costs. If everyone had insurance costs would go down. The problem with ACA is the penalty is not severe enough to encourage everyone to buy. My friend chooses to pay the penalty each year instead of paying for health insurance.

Originally Posted by deltahoosier

What have I lied about. So Obama did not start his actual campaign in 2008 in his house but we are going to dance around that Obama has ties to Ayers and how that is? Really? That is a lie huh. Why does it bother you that Obama would be tied to Ayers? Don't like the democrats true roots to be on display? Don't want to be associated with police station bombers? How about city burner downers? How about cop shooters?

Where those "democrats" that violently took over a visitor center at a national park in Oregon? Where those "democrats" that were ready to start a shootout over the rights to public land?

[QUOTE]I don't know if Trump would be better for Russia considering Hilary's foundations were lining their pockets with Russian money for her pushing uranium sales their way. [/QUOTE
^^^This is something Hannity says at least 4-5 times per show. It isn't really true, it just sounds terrible but its hype. Again, it isn't true, you should really stop that propagating proven fake news.
http://www.businessinsider.com/every...scandal-2015-4
http://www.factcheck.org/2015/04/no-...-uranium-deal/
Agree pretty much that they are all dirty.
Even if McCain voted in favor...they were never going to get bill to law as written. As I recall during the campaign trump promised healthcare better than ACA and less expensive than ACA, that bill went 0 for 2 on that promise or just 2 more lies.
Clinton got booted from office, hardly "getting away with it". For some reason women were drawn to the guy even tho he was an ass. Women are attracted to the "bad boy" then they whine when he treats them bad. Duh.
Hey where is trump? Vacation again? I thought trump got pissed at Obama for way less...Do as I say, not as I do...

Originally Posted by deltahoosier

What have I lied about. So Obama did not start his actual campaign in 2008 in his house but we are going to dance around that Obama has ties to Ayers and how that is? Really? That is a lie huh.

YES, THAT'S A LIE! It was sure framed that way so redneck rasists would think this jumped up darky was a terrorist about to take over the white house but the truth was the meeting was in 2001, 7 years earlier in the run for Senate.

Originally Posted by wake77

...And you are way off base believing health insurance caused massive increases to health-care costs. If everyone had insurance costs would go down.

I don't think that is true, IMO the problem you have is the collusion between insurance and Healthcare industries supported by lobbing at the central government level. Insurance companies want Healthcare costs high to increase premiums and scare people in to needing insurance, Healthcare want it high to increase profits. Government won't break the cartel because they line their pockets quite nicely.

Will be super interesting how the Don is going to handle N Korea. Anybody think he will order a preemptive strike?

Originally Posted by 95sn

[QUOTE]I don't know if Trump would be better for Russia considering Hilary's foundations were lining their pockets with Russian money for her pushing uranium sales their way. [/QUOTE
^^^This is something Hannity says at least 4-5 times per show. It isn't really true, it just sounds terrible but its hype. Again, it isn't true, you should really stop that propagating proven fake news.
http://www.businessinsider.com/every...scandal-2015-4
http://www.factcheck.org/2015/04/no-...-uranium-deal/
Agree pretty much that they are all dirty.
Even if McCain voted in favor...they were never going to get bill to law as written. As I recall during the campaign trump promised healthcare better than ACA and less expensive than ACA, that bill went 0 for 2 on that promise or just 2 more lies.
Clinton got booted from office, hardly "getting away with it". For some reason women were drawn to the guy even tho he was an ass. Women are attracted to the "bad boy" then they whine when he treats them bad. Duh.
Hey where is trump? Vacation again? I thought trump got pissed at Obama for way less...Do as I say, not as I do...

Clinton did not get booted from office. He finished his two terms and his supporters still think his impeachment was based on a blow job. It was based on his lying about sexual harrasement and lying about it in a court of law.

Deflect much. I don't care where Trump is just like I did not care where Obama was.

Originally Posted by ralph

YES, THAT'S A LIE! It was sure framed that way so redneck rasists would think this jumped up darky was a terrorist about to take over the white house but the truth was the meeting was in 2001, 7 years earlier in the run for Senate.

Racists? You use words that you don't know what they mean. America is 12% black. White people had to vote for Obama. Only people trying to frame the race card are democrats.

Either way, he knows Ayers and had a communist father. Why are you scared that he has ties to a terrorist? Do you know what community organizing is?

Originally Posted by wake77

Where those "democrats" that violently took over a visitor center at a national park in Oregon? Where those "democrats" that were ready to start a shootout over the rights to public land?

I don't no. Were they all Republicans in the group? There was no violence in either stand off except when the FBI gunned down that one guy in cold blood on a snowy highway. Interesting on what you call violent take overs. Is this one of the many lies you guys tell but want to try and jump me?

Originally Posted by 95sn

[QUOTE]I don't know if Trump would be better for Russia considering Hilary's foundations were lining their pockets with Russian money for her pushing uranium sales their way. [/QUOTE
^^^This is something Hannity says at least 4-5 times per show. It isn't really true, it just sounds terrible but its hype. Again, it isn't true, you should really stop that propagating proven fake news.
http://www.businessinsider.com/every...scandal-2015-4
http://www.factcheck.org/2015/04/no-...-uranium-deal/
Agree pretty much that they are all dirty.
Even if McCain voted in favor...they were never going to get bill to law as written. As I recall during the campaign trump promised healthcare better than ACA and less expensive than ACA, that bill went 0 for 2 on that promise or just 2 more lies.
Clinton got booted from office, hardly "getting away with it". For some reason women were drawn to the guy even tho he was an ass. Women are attracted to the "bad boy" then they whine when he treats them bad. Duh.
Hey where is trump? Vacation again? I thought trump got pissed at Obama for way less...Do as I say, not as I do...

Your article said those things happened. DO you even read the things you post? It only says that thing that works in her favor is others had to sign off on it too. There was money donated to her fund at that time.

Originally Posted by wake77

That is part of the "truth". The other part of the "truth" is that doctors sometimes screw up and maybe, just maybe they cause damage in excess of proposed caps.

What world are you living in where you believe "credit cards cause product prices to sky rocket"? And you are way off base believing health insurance caused massive increases to health-care costs. If everyone had insurance costs would go down. The problem with ACA is the penalty is not severe enough to encourage everyone to buy. My friend chooses to pay the penalty each year instead of paying for health insurance.

You don't know anything about cause and effect do you. More money (virtual or real) cause the prices to inflate. Money in any system for the same products does not make ANYTHING EVER cheaper. If you can not grasp that, then there is no point in even talking to you.

People having insurance is what caused the prices to go up. There is a deeper set of pockets to socialize the costs. If people don't have the ability to pay, doctors have to charge less or simply not provide a service. It is that simple.

As far as your friend paying the penalty. That is money that can not go to other goods and services. Thus there is less money competition for goods and services. Depends on what that is (usually service industries) they have to keep prices lower to attract the less money in the market.

Originally Posted by deltahoosier

Racists? You use words that you don't know what they mean. America is 12% black. White people had to vote for Obama. Only people trying to frame the race card are democrats.

Either way, he knows Ayers and had a communist father. Why are you scared that he has ties to a terrorist? Do you know what community organizing is?

No concession that you tried to combine two events that were 7 years apart?

Pretty sure i know what racist means, my point wasn't that US as a group is racist, just that racist tactics were emplyoed to try and eliminate Obama as a candidate. No doubt this was used by both Republican and democrats equally through different stages of the campaign.

Not scared of anything but i don't think they way you characterize the relationship as something significant represents reality but regardless Obamas record is there for all to see regardless of how he got there.

Originally Posted by deltahoosier

I don't no. Were they all Republicans in the group? There was no violence in either stand off except when the FBI gunned down that one guy in cold blood on a snowy highway. Interesting on what you call violent take overs. Is this one of the many lies you guys tell but want to try and jump me?

When a group of guys walk in with a bunch of firearms and take over a building, what do you call it?

Gotta love the president stuffing his pants on Twitter with nuclear talk. He's basically using Twitter the same way high school kids do who are about to fight, but with nucs. What a ****ing idiot and all of you who voted for him, we now have this to worry about.

Originally Posted by TheWakeIsReal

Gotta love the president stuffing his pants on Twitter with nuclear talk. He's basically using Twitter the same way high school kids do who are about to fight, but with nucs. What a ****ing idiot and all of you who voted for him, we now have this to worry about.

Although stupid of him, at least someone finally spoke a language the North Koreans understand. They don't get diplomatic talk & think it's weakness.

Originally Posted by racer808

Although stupid of him, at least someone finally spoke a language the North Koreans understand. They don't get diplomatic talk & think it's weakness.

So you're all for nuclear warfare? Of course you are, it doesn't make any difference to us. They won't reach us right? It'll be the surrounding areas and our allies that suffer for us "being a super power". And if China takes a side? What are we going back to? Mutually assured destruction?

You're talking big and bad to a guy who very clearly has mental health issues and doesn't care about his people. Trump doesn't even have an ambassador to the neighboring country who is most likely to suffer from his rhetoric.

Originally Posted by wake77

TWhat world are you living in where you believe "credit cards cause product prices to sky rocket"? And you are way off base believing health insurance caused massive increases to health-care costs. If everyone had insurance costs would go down. The problem with ACA is the penalty is not severe enough to encourage everyone to buy. My friend chooses to pay the penalty each year instead of paying for health insurance.

Actually, one of the few times I agree with delta, he is right. There are so many policies created to coerce people into buying HI with money they don't have or can't control that HC/HI has suffered from hyper inflation way beyond what could be expected if each individual had to make the decision to buy HI out of the money in their own bank account.

At this point cost controls are the only thing that's going to fix the problem. How those cost will be controlled is the big question.

Originally Posted by TheWakeIsReal

So you're all for nuclear warfare? Of course you are, it doesn't make any difference to us. They won't reach us right? It'll be the surrounding areas and our allies that suffer for us "being a super power". And if China takes a side? What are we going back to? Mutually assured destruction?

You're talking big and bad to a guy who very clearly has mental health issues and doesn't care about his people. Trump doesn't even have an ambassador to the neighboring country who is most likely to suffer from his rhetoric.

I'm not sure how you can go on some crazy diatribe accusing me of that based on what I typed. You sound like your head could use examining as well. Just curious, where was all your faux rage when the last 3 presidents didn't do ****? Diplomacy has failed miserably. Please tell me, Mouth of Wisdom, how should this be handled?

What trump admin is actually doing (aside from trump spouting off) is pretty much exactly the same as prior admins.

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/0...h-korea-241389

^^^agree, and there isn't much other in the way of alternatives. The previous presidents all were able to stall n.korea and their advancement of nucs for several years each. It appears to be the right approach. Kill them financially. KJU will feed himself and his army, eventually the rest of the country will revolt. Sanctions are not a overnight deal. You have to squeeze the neck slowly.
The difference now is that we have never had a president stupid enough to go all Samuel Jackson on KJU.
They will be met with Fire and Fury and frankly power the likes of which the world has never seen.
Other than little kids or army movies in the 60's, who talks like that? Who makes wild threats?
Its alarming. I'm not prepped for WWIII.

You're telling me. I can almost see Guam from my house.

DO you even read the things you post?

Yes, she was one of 9 and their charity profited too. So 1/9th responsible you could say that and be much more accurate. Also I don't believe that Clintons used their foundation as trump does...for his political campaign, to settle legal problems, fund film maker Project Veritas (remember him?) and buy a 6ft portrait of himself....
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...l-gain/499535/

I can almost see Guam from my house.

ok sarah palin sorry, couldn't help myself.

Originally Posted by 95sn

ok sarah palin sorry, couldn't help myself.

Glad someone got the reference.

Originally Posted by ralph

No concession that you tried to combine two events that were 7 years apart?

Pretty sure i know what racist means, my point wasn't that US as a group is racist, just that racist tactics were emplyoed to try and eliminate Obama as a candidate. No doubt this was used by both Republican and democrats equally through different stages of the campaign.

Not scared of anything but i don't think they way you characterize the relationship as something significant represents reality but regardless Obamas record is there for all to see regardless of how he got there.

I am pretty sure you don't know what racists means or you would not be using it in such a flippant manner. If anything those tactics and more are used against Republican candidates. Every single Republican is labeled a racist, anti woman, anti gay, anti this and anti that. The words are so watered down they have no meaning.

I know Obama's record is there and so is his book where he wrote about his leftist ideology.

Originally Posted by wake77

When a group of guys walk in with a bunch of firearms and take over a building, what do you call it?

There was no one in the building. The workers were told to stay home until further notice. The only shooting happened by the FBI when Bundy was driving to the law enforcement of the next county. He was gunned down when he wrecked into the field next to a barricade then jumped out of his truck into the snowy field. It is all on tape for you to see.

I think he was stupid in general but I appreciate why he did it because two ranchers were sentenced to prison for arson for setting a back fire on their own property.

Originally Posted by TheWakeIsReal

Gotta love the president stuffing his pants on Twitter with nuclear talk. He's basically using Twitter the same way high school kids do who are about to fight, but with nucs. What a ****ing idiot and all of you who voted for him, we now have this to worry about.

When the democrats want to keep putting up leftists as candidates selling out America, demanding safe spaces, burning cities, and beating up Republicans; this is what you get.

I think he needs to be the twitter away in general but Korea is not his fault. This is what happens when you have policies that coddle tyrants.

Originally Posted by TheWakeIsReal

So you're all for nuclear warfare? Of course you are, it doesn't make any difference to us. They won't reach us right? It'll be the surrounding areas and our allies that suffer for us "being a super power". And if China takes a side? What are we going back to? Mutually assured destruction?

You're talking big and bad to a guy who very clearly has mental health issues and doesn't care about his people. Trump doesn't even have an ambassador to the neighboring country who is most likely to suffer from his rhetoric.

Exact same thing the left said about Reagan. Learn about negotiating.

Originally Posted by 95sn

Yes, she was one of 9 and their charity profited too. So 1/9th responsible you could say that and be much more accurate. Also I don't believe that Clintons used their foundation as trump does...for his political campaign, to settle legal problems, fund film maker Project Veritas (remember him?) and buy a 6ft portrait of himself....
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...l-gain/499535/

Clinton Foundation Donations Fall Precipitously After Trump’s Election

https://www.thenewamerican.com/usnew...ump-s-election

Originally Posted by 95sn

ok sarah palin sorry, couldn't help myself.

Weird thing is that Sara Palin never said it. Tina Fey said it on Saturday Night Live.

They will be met with Fire and Fury and frankly power the likes of which the world has never seen.
Other than little kids or army movies in the 60's, who talks like that? Who makes wild threats?

President Truman said basically the same thing to Japan.

Originally Posted by grant_west

President Truman said basically the same thing to Japan.

And how did that workout again? Oh 200,000 civilians were killed. Was nothing learned?

Aside from vague geographical proximity I'm not sure I see many parallels between Japan in 1945 and ROK 2017.

We were at war with Japan. We are not at war with North Korea.
Japan was losing, but still occupying much of Asia (including the Korean peninsula). North Korea hasn't invaded anyone for 60+ years.
Japan was a military threat, NK really isn't (its army would likely starve 2 weeks into any war)
Japan didn't have a nuke, NK does.

Originally Posted by shawndoggy

Aside from vague geographical proximity I'm not sure I see many parallels between Japan in 1945 and ROK 2017.

We were at war with Japan. We are not at war with North Korea.
Japan was losing, but still occupying much of Asia (including the Korean peninsula). North Korea hasn't invaded anyone for 60+ years.
Japan was a military threat, NK really isn't (its army would likely starve 2 weeks into any war)
Japan didn't have a nuke, NK does.

Technically we are at war since it was an armistice. Most of what I read is Best Koreas military is fed, armed & ready to invade the south & the more they wait they not be fed armed & ready for war. They've been pretty clear in their demand; "get out of way & stay out of the invasion of the South."

The rest of you should sim a don nah. Norths Koreas threats are so overblown by our idiots in the media. Best Korea specifically said they were going to fire the missiles towards Guam but they would land 30-40 km off the coast. Pretty obvious they're signalling a change in testing but that it's a test & please don't nuke us in response. The rest is hyperbole, plain & simple. Trump cannot just give the order to fire a nuke for ****s & grins. There is a multitude of people involved with the decision to launch & that is when Drump will be given the option to fire. You people act like he can just decide to nuke someone & no one in Gov can challenge it. Getting pretty sad when Drump is looking more adultish than the rabid insanity on display with the sky is falling crowd.

Originally Posted by racer808

Technically we are at war since it was an armistice. Most of what I read is Best Koreas military is fed, armed & ready to invade the south & the more they wait they not be fed armed & ready for war. They've been pretty clear in their demand; "get out of way & stay out of the invasion of the South."

That would be true if we'd declared war on North Korea in the first place. We never did. Last time USA declared war was WWII.

Originally Posted by shawndoggy

That would be true if we'd declared war on North Korea in the first place. We never did. Last time USA declared war was WWII.

True. So technically the north & south are at war.

Quote:
Originally Posted by grant_west View Post
President Truman said basically the same thing to Japan.
And how did that workout again? Oh 200,000 civilians were killed. Was nothing learned?

Ummm I would say if you're an American it worked out pretty goddamn well!

Many historians calculate that dropping the bomb on Hiroshima and Nagasaki saved many more lives because it ended the war abruptly and if we wouldn't have it could've gone on for years and the over all death toll would have been more.

For educated people you guys seem to easily forget the past what I'm saying is not revolutionary, common knowledge I'm glad we had a president with some balls to drop the bomb on Japan. Lord knows if we would have Barry Obama at the wheel this go round GUAM would rightfully so been shaking in its boots. Fat face isn't going to do jack. He knows that Trump would do exactly what he said he would do. Unleash fire in fury

so remind me... how many pearl harbors has North Korea pulled off?

That whole premise is flawed. All they had to do was drop the bomb off the coast after a warning that said watch what happens and the next one is hitting land in a week and it would have been over. But it was never about ending the war - it was about Truman wiggling his dick at Russia to keep them out and the fact that Japanese civilians were not considered people.

You bleeding hearts think you can always hug it out. I wish your world existed.

Originally Posted by grant_west

You bleeding hearts think you can always hug it out. I wish your world existed.

So in your world how many pearl harbors has NK even attempted, Grant? Trying to gauge what sort of a threat you believe them to be.

Fat face isn't going to do jack. He knows that Trump would do exactly what he said he would do. Unleash fire in fury

And you are saying what, Grant? What is "fire and fury" Bigger and worse than Dresden? Bigger and worse than Hiroshima/Nagasaki? And in response to what provocation, exactly?

Trump hasn't done exactly what he said he would do on much of anything. While is this the red line where he backs up locker room talk with actual actions?

Originally Posted by shawndoggy

So in your world how many pearl harbors has NK even attempted, Grant? Trying to gauge what sort of a threat you believe them to be.



And you are saying what, Grant? What is "fire and fury" Bigger and worse than Dresden? Bigger and worse than Hiroshima/Nagasaki? And in response to what provocation, exactly?

Trump hasn't done exactly what he said he would do on much of anything. While is this the red line where he backs up locker room talk with actual actions?

That statement about Pearl Harbor completely dismisses all the other attacks Best Korea has done & never once have we or the south responded. Best Korea has sunk ships, subs, shelled islands & killed south koreans, in 1968 they captured one of our ships, tortured the crew & killed one. Some time later they shot one of our planes down over international waters killing all 31 on board. Best Korea also funds & is openly behind their terrorist group operating in the south for "reunification". Best Korea has crossed the border & attempted to kill two South Korean presidents, they've fired across the border multiple times killing south korean soldiers. Hell there are so many incidents I can't even list them all or copy & paste. How long do you allow do you allow a guy to commit murders & attacks on a small scale? Everyone of them was a declaration of war that we ignored.

^^^And that justifies dropping a nuc? In my book, not even close.

Originally Posted by pesos

That whole premise is flawed. All they had to do was drop the bomb off the coast after a warning that said watch what happens and the next one is hitting land in a week and it would have been over. But it was never about ending the war - it was about Truman wiggling his dick at Russia to keep them out and the fact that Japanese civilians were not considered people.

So the brutal fire bombing of Tokyo and other cities weren't enough, but dropping a bomb in the ocean would have stopped the Japanese war effort? Right........ The fire bombings were way worse that the A-bomb from a humanity stand point. Dropping a bomb in the ocean would have done zero.

Originally Posted by 95sn

^^^And that justifies dropping a nuc? In my book, not even close.

Who's dropping nukes? Why is the list of people on here that can think rationally so small?

Originally Posted by shawndoggy

so remind me... how many pearl harbors has North Korea pulled off?

Not sure, but they killed around 36,000 Americans in 3 years when they invaded a country. Japan in 4 year war killed 111,000 Americans as the primary force.

Originally Posted by shawndoggy

So in your world how many pearl harbors has NK even attempted, Grant? Trying to gauge what sort of a threat you believe them to be.



And you are saying what, Grant? What is "fire and fury" Bigger and worse than Dresden? Bigger and worse than Hiroshima/Nagasaki? And in response to what provocation, exactly?

Trump hasn't done exactly what he said he would do on much of anything. While is this the red line where he backs up locker room talk with actual actions?

You mean red lines like the one with Russia in regards to the Ukraine? or Syria? oh that was the other guy.

This is like the cold war. We have to take a strong stance.

I see it this way. The little round guy in Korea seems to have a strong sense of preservation. He has murdered his brother and his uncle and I am sure many others around. That tells me he is like any other man. He is a self entitled enabled little man, but a man just the same. He is motivated by being in power and staying alive. He is not like the religious wackos in the middle east where they get an Imam to declare a fatwa and go on a killing spree to get their 72 virgin men (they never said women, they just said virgins).

So. He was to stay alive. Why all this sabre rattling? My guess is society or his military is growing tired of him. He is trying to mobilize nationalism or something (wag the dog?). Trump has to play the same game as Reagan. Keep a firm hand. Keep a similar retoric as the little fat man's culture. Keep the heat on him. I have a feeling if his generals understand they are all going to die, they just may off him. Or the little fat guy skims the top and provides his own safety and settles down. Or he could just be crazy and actually believe that he is the ruler of the universe.

how is it like the cold war at all? In the cold war there were superpowers who were manipulating pawn governments to their advantage in a global chess game. Here you've got a pawn gone rogue, that nobody apparently can control.

I agree 100% with the rest of your analysis tho. Kim is completely rational, he's just in a reality that most people don't try to understand (you have -- kudos!).

Originally Posted by shawndoggy

how is it like the cold war at all? In the cold war there were superpowers who were manipulating pawn governments to their advantage in a global chess game. Here you've got a pawn gone rogue, that nobody apparently can control.

I agree 100% with the rest of your analysis tho. Kim is completely rational, he's just in a reality that most people don't try to understand (you have -- kudos!).

It is like the cold war where you have a open democratic western societies vs closed, secretive repressed societies. You have a nuclear arms race (though we are way ahead) with leaders in the repressive country trying to figure out a way to stay in power. We as the same western society have to contain this threat, allow him to yell insults over the fence and yell back that we are going to kill him. Same game, different time.

Only differences is that most of those old soviet leaders lived through WW2. They knew how bad it could get. I am not so sure the little fat man knows. That is troublesome. Some of his Generals may? don't know. Not sure any are around from Korean war. It may depend if he really believes we can kill him or not. IF he thinks he is safe, then we may have a mad man on our hands. History is full of idiots like that guy.

Originally Posted by fly135

Actually, one of the few times I agree with delta, he is right. There are so many policies created to coerce people into buying HI with money they don't have or can't control that HC/HI has suffered from hyper inflation way beyond what could be expected if each individual had to make the decision to buy HI out of the money in their own bank account.

At this point cost controls are the only thing that's going to fix the problem. How those cost will be controlled is the big question.

Do you feel that credit cards caused prices to skyrocket?

Originally Posted by racer808

Trump cannot just give the order to fire a nuke for ****s & grins. There is a multitude of people involved with the decision to launch & that is when Drump will be given the option to fire. You people act like he can just decide to nuke someone & no one in Gov can challenge it.

Nah dude, he can just push the button, he doesn't need to ask his mum. Look it up, procedure was set so the president could respond chop chop to a frisky nuke from the commies.

Originally Posted by grant_west

Ummm I would say if you're an American it worked out pretty goddamn well!

If you say so, but aren't the"Good guys" supposed to not target civilians?

Ralph: personally I think the US did a great thing ending the war by dropping the bomb (At the time it was the right choice)

Do you think if Japan would have had the ability to wipe the US off the face of the earth they would have done it. If your answer is No then I can tell you your wrong. Same go's for NK. If they had the night of the US they would be the Nazi Germany

Originally Posted by wake77

Do you feel that credit cards caused prices to skyrocket?

No. Credit has an inflationary effect, but there are other market factors such as the scale of economy to consider. WRT HC, I doubt CCs skyrocketed prices.

Originally Posted by ralph

If you say so, but aren't the"Good guys" supposed to not target civilians?

You live in a bubble. The world was in a all out war. Total destruction. The Japanese were performing germ warfare experiments against the chinese and were overall ruthless. The military leaders were coddled aristocrats. The war machine was supplied by the people through the buildings, roads, trains, and factories. They were the labor and the warriors being led to be a destructive force by the leaders. This whole notion of not targeting the civilian population centers is a very naive idea of total war. The cities are the infastructure of the of the war machine. The civilians are free to leave for safety. This is not dudes in blue and red coats lining up and shooting at each other while the civilians sit by and have a picnic. Ask the civilians that the japanese enslaved?

Originally Posted by fly135

No. Credit has an inflationary effect, but there are other market factors such as the scale of economy to consider. WRT HC, I doubt CCs skyrocketed prices.

I don't believe CC inflate healthcare, however they do inflate electronics and other goodies. Cheap long term loans inflate cars, boats and houses.