2020 dem pres pick

Originally Posted by denverd1

when the idiots say socialism, I think socialism.

Exactly! That's why Republicans keep saying it.

Originally Posted by fly135

Exactly! That's why Republicans keep saying it.

Andrew Yang. Universal basic income of $1,000 per month for everyone. Explain how this is not socialism.

Originally Posted by denverd1

Andrew Yang. Universal basic income of $1,000 per month for everyone. Explain how this is not socialism.

How is it different from free police, free fire, free education, free military, free roads and highways?

Or better yet, how does such a staunchly republican state like Alaska participate in such a similar scheme and not go all ANTIFA?

Originally Posted by shawndoggy

How is it different from free police, free fire, free education, free military, free roads and highways?

Or better yet, how does such a staunchly republican state like Alaska participate in such a similar scheme and not go all ANTIFA?

False. None of that is Free. Kids in California have to pay for the bus to school. Taxes are already so high to support what you have there, that middle class is getting to be none existent.

Originally Posted by DeltaHoosier

False. None of that is Free. Kids in California have to pay for the bus to school. Taxes are already so high to support what you have there, that middle class is getting to be none existent.

Of course it's not free. It's all paid for with taxes. Collecting taxes and spending them for the public good is not socialism.

If all you are talking about is the redistribution of wealth, then is the $28B (and counting) "bailout" of farmers as the result of cancelled sales to the Chinese (far far more than the "government motors" bailout ended up costing) also socialism? If not, why not? What about the mortgage interest deduction?

Originally Posted by shawndoggy

Of course it's not free. It's all paid for with taxes. Collecting taxes and spending them for the public good is not socialism.



If all you are talking about is the redistribution of wealth, then is the $28B (and counting) "bailout" of farmers as the result of cancelled sales to the Chinese (far far more than the "government motors" bailout ended up costing) also socialism? If not, why not? What about the mortgage interest deduction?

Giving away 1000 a month for absolutely no reason is a very big step closer to socialism. While it may not technically be defined as socialism, it's a far cry from the capitalist system the country was founded upon.

AOC is a self proclaimed socialist. And the left parades her dumbass around like we should put her face on the statue of liberty.

Originally Posted by denverd1

Giving away 1000 a month for absolutely no reason is a very big step closer to socialism. While it may not technically be defined as socialism, it's a far cry from the capitalist system the country was founded upon.

AOC is a self proclaimed socialist. And the left parades her dumbass around like we should put her face on the statue of liberty.

Clearly you don't understand what UBI is.

Originally Posted by denverd1

Giving away 1000 a month for absolutely no reason is a very big step closer to socialism. While it may not technically be defined as socialism, it's a far cry from the capitalist system the country was founded upon.

So maybe you can explain how things like the state and local tax deduction, the mortgage interest tax deduction and the earned income tax credit and the personal exemption are consistent with "the capitalist system the country was founded upon"? How is giving a credit on taxes to certain individuals not a subsidy? How is collecting less revenue than you spend consistent with capitalism (LOL I know I know -- UBER, right?)?

Originally Posted by denverd1

AOC is a self proclaimed socialist. And the left parades her dumbass around like we should put her face on the statue of liberty.

Well that's what fox wants you to believe anyway. I guess maybe we should all settle on a definition of what socialism actually is? Then we can decide whether a policy is socialist or not.

Or is the idea just if you proclaim you are or are not a thing then it's true? Like how the NAZIs were socialists, because socialist was right there in the name (National Socialist German Workers Party)? Ergo, Bernie = NAZI, right?

Originally Posted by shawndoggy

How is it different from free police, free fire, free education, free military, free roads and highways?

Or better yet, how does such a staunchly republican state like Alaska participate in such a similar scheme and not go all ANTIFA?

Those are services enjoyed by everyone in the community. not just the unemployed

Originally Posted by denverd1

Those are services enjoyed by everyone in the community. not just the unemployed

That and they are trying to attract people to settle there, otherwise their worker base will move away for better climate.

Originally Posted by denverd1

Those are services enjoyed by everyone in the community. not just the unemployed

That would also be the case with the freedom dividend (i.e. $1k a month UBI). Everyone gets, not just the unemployed.

Originally Posted by shawndoggy

That would also be the case with the freedom dividend (i.e. $1k a month UBI). Everyone gets, not just the unemployed.

If everyone gets it, then where are you pulling the billions away from? Price of basic needs will rise to capture that offset in cash. Soon you start looking like California where you have so many regulated "have too's" that people can not even afford to by into the most basics of the standards of living

Originally Posted by DeltaHoosier

If everyone gets it, then where are you pulling the billions away from? Price of basic needs will rise to capture that offset in cash. Soon you start looking like California where you have so many regulated "have too's" that people can not even afford to by into the most basics of the standards of living

Thankfully his website isn't on the darkweb, so if you google it you are sure to find it.

https://www.yang2020.com/what-is-freedom-dividend-faq/

It would be easier than you might think. Andrew proposes funding the Freedom Dividend by consolidating some welfare programs and implementing a Value Added Tax of 10 percent. Current welfare and social program beneficiaries would be given a choice between their current benefits or $1,000 cash unconditionally – most would prefer cash with no restriction.

A Value Added Tax (VAT) is a tax on the production of goods or services a business produces. It is a fair tax and it makes it much harder for large corporations, who are experts at hiding profits and income, to avoid paying their fair share. A VAT is nothing new. 160 out of 193 countries in the world already have a Value Added Tax or something similar, including all of Europe which has an average VAT of 20 percent.

The means to pay for the basic income will come from four sources:

1. Current spending: We currently spend between $500 and $600 billion a year on welfare programs, food stamps, disability and the like. This reduces the cost of the Freedom Dividend because people already receiving benefits would have a choice between keeping their current benefits and the $1,000, and would not receive both.

Additionally, we currently spend over 1 trillion dollars on health care, incarceration, homelessness services and the like. We would save $100 – 200+ billion as people would be able to take better care of themselves and avoid the emergency room, jail, and the street and would generally be more functional. The Freedom Dividend would pay for itself by helping people avoid our institutions, which is when our costs shoot up. Some studies have shown that $1 to a poor parent will result in as much as $7 in cost-savings and economic growth.

2. A VAT: Our economy is now incredibly vast at $19 trillion, up $4 trillion in the last 10 years alone. A VAT at half the European level would generate $800 billion in new revenue A VAT will become more and more important as technology improves because you cannot collect income tax from robots or software.

3. New revenue: Putting money into the hands of American consumers would grow the economy. The Roosevelt Institute projected that the economy will grow by approximately $2.5 trillion and create 4.6 million new jobs. This would generate approximately $800 – 900 billion in new revenue from economic growth.

4. Taxes on top earners and pollution: By removing the Social Security cap, implementing a financial transactions tax, and ending the favorable tax treatment for capital gains/carried interest, we can decrease financial speculation while also funding the Freedom Dividend. We can add to that a carbon fee that will be partially dedicated to funding the Freedom Dividend, making up the remaining balance required to cover the cost of this program.

Originally Posted by denverd1

Andrew Yang. Universal basic income of $1,000 per month for everyone. Explain how this is not socialism.

Socialism is socializing the means of production and dissolving private property rights. Explain how UBI is socialism?

Originally Posted by ralph

Socialism is socializing the means of production and dissolving private property rights. Explain how UBI is socialism?

Is your hard earned money not your property? You can keep it put under your bed. Almost anything with it. Illegal to destroy but it is yours. It is in place of chickens, goats, and daughters of days gone by. The money you force from my hand is the more labor I have to produce to make up for it. That is socializing and forcing my labor to survive.

Basically what you are trying to argue is if I don't come down and take your grain, but instead take all the money you made from the grain sale, then it is not socialism? right.......