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Old     (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       08-11-2015, 6:11 AM Reply   
The house/lot we just bought is pretty awesome but one thing I would really like to add this fall or spring would be a nice walk-in beach.

Right now we have about 330 ft. of frontage, ~220 ft of that is rock sea-wall, the other 110ft is a vertical wooden sea-wall. er the DNR, we get 35% of our shoreline that is fair game to alter ... And as long as I keep the beach area under 2000 ft^2 I only need one basic permit (the easy one to get).

We want to do this because its a pain since other boats (we have lots of friends and family on the lake) just can't pull up and beach at our place... same goes for us, its a pain to have to put the boat on the lift if we want to pull in for a few minutes. In addition to that, swimming, the risk of the dogs falling in, etc etc make the wall a bit of a pain.

The water is about 24"-26" deep at the wooden wall, and that is my problem.... what is the best way to get a nice smooth transition from the yard without having the lake erode / push into our property too far? I assume there are two ways to do this:
1. Truck in sand and grade that 24" drop off myself .... I have access to a pretty much unlimited amount of sand
2. Let nature do its thing and just eat that 24" away and then add the beach after things have stabilized


So this is the property - the red lines are the property lines +/- and the outlined area is kinda what I'm thinking for the beach.


This would be the rough area I would want to alter
Old     (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       08-11-2015, 6:18 AM Reply   
I would probably do 2 things.

1. First I would expand the dock to allow for a few more boats to pull in as well as a non-lift spot for your boat. If you add a T to the dock, you can have several boat spaces. The reason I would do this is a) beaching the boat will damage it over time b) anchors are cumbersome for quick stops c) getting sand in the boat and in your house is going to suck.

2. Build out the beach by grading the existing dirt out and then adding sand on top. The beach is definitely a nice things to have for dogs and kids to play.
Old     (hco)      Join Date: Jun 2006       08-11-2015, 6:45 AM Reply   
For the amount of hassle, labor, permits, etc... that you're going to put into this whole beach thing, I think it would be really worth just building a bigger/better dock. Less maintenance over the course of it's lifetime (you will have erosion and need to rake it), and a dock is much better for the boats.
Old     (hco)      Join Date: Jun 2006       08-11-2015, 6:49 AM Reply   
Build/buy a U-shaped dock with your lift and canopy over the center space. Your life will be better.



Old     (cadunkle)      Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: NJ       08-11-2015, 7:50 AM Reply   
So long as the local government won't give you grief, I would just do a larger dock and leave the seawall in place. Could go as simple as you want or as fancy as you want with cover, second story deck, etc... A sandy beach seems like a lot of work and creates additional maintenance and mess, particularly if you already have a good seawall in place to eliminate erosion.
Old     (EchoSkis)      Join Date: Mar 2015       08-11-2015, 8:07 AM Reply   
We have done two beaches. Both times we just had the area dug out to just above the water line and then backfilled with sand. Where our cottage is all we needed was a grading permit. We get a little bit of a cliff where the water meets the sand but it is still really nice. We do have to add new sand about every 3 years, but that will depend on how much traffic your lake gets. To help combat erosion we have rocks outlining the beach. If you wanted the beach to be a completely natural slope with no cliff then you are going to need it sloped at a really low angle. The guys that build slalom lakes have a lot of info on what angles work well.
Old     (99Bison)      Join Date: Sep 2012       08-11-2015, 8:12 AM Reply   
1. More dock, allow for 2-3 boats including yours to park there. You're not getting more than that on your beach anyway.
- Dock is so much better in general for parking your boats.
- Don't put your sand in front of your dock entry points, keep a non sand path.

2. Just make a "sand box" instead of a beach. If desired to make it near the water make a "retaining wall" bench/etc on the lake side for people/animals to create a boundary.
- If you are really really dead set on a beach
-- Be realistic on understanding what you can end up with
-- Is the lake naturally sandy on your shore? If not your sand will just wash away.
-- Can you put your beach in a natural cove shape on your property? If so this would help with erosion.
-- Remove the area you want as beach, but make sure to create rigid sides that angle in for the graded flatter area. If you don't do this you'll likely end up with erosion behind the current retaining walls as well.
-- You'll end up with something like say a 40 ft gap in retaining wall, 10 ft on each side slanting in and that leaves you 20 ft of beach 10-15 feet back at best.
-- To get say 100 feet of sandy beach you see this done with huge rock point/piles on each side 100 ft out into the water, thus creating a natural cove. Don't think your simple permit will fly for this.
Old     (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       08-11-2015, 8:14 AM Reply   
The docks in the photo will be gone/replace next spring, my brother is a dealer for many lift/dock companies so we're still just rying to figure out how exactly we want the setup to look like... but they will be roll-in / removable docks; they will also move to the East (Right in the photos) to open up beach space. ... we currently have a lift and canopy too, I just used an older photo before it showed up.

Quote:
So long as the local government won't give you grief,
They will... Docks can only be 6' wide at their max or have any fixed roof or second story.... also cannot extend past the end of the boat. Also permanent docks doesn't usually survive winters, so we're stuck with roll-in / removable docks. So building an nice big dock isn't really a (good) option.

.... Our lake is pure sand, the whole area, sand hundreds of feet deep, so beaching here and there when we pull up for a quick bathroom break or to re-stock the cooler isn't a big concern to me. The biggest problem is getting in and out of the lakes, like mentioned for kids and dogs .... steps are a pain in the ass and get slippery and its deep enough at the wall where our dogs falling wouldn't allow them to touch. 95% of the time if we want to swim, we take the boat over to a friends house with nice beach or my mom's place jsut down the lake. As far as hassle, I have access to unlimited amounts of sand, a skid-steer, dump trailer, and two cousins and a brother for slave labor.


Here is the setup with a lake view and my plan (beach between the RED) and move the lift / docks down


My mom's house below - I really grew to love having a nice big beach with easy entry and exit
Old     (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       08-11-2015, 8:18 AM Reply   
Quote:
If desired to make it near the water make a "retaining wall" bench/etc on the lake side for people/animals to create a boundary.
I would like the opposite of that though ... no boundary, just a nice smooth transition from yard --> sand --> lake
Old     (seth)      Join Date: Sep 2002       08-11-2015, 9:01 AM Reply   
Just take out the wall and make it like your mom's place, that seems to be working well with little erosion.
Old     (TomH)      Join Date: Jan 2014       08-12-2015, 8:36 AM Reply   
It's hard to tell, but the picture from the lake looking back at the house, looks like you'd be better off moving your beach to the left where it looks to be a gentler grade to the lake, but the picture might be deceiving. Like above, I'd grade it out like your mom's place, and put in some boundary between the sand and grass (short block wall, rocks, timbers, etc.).
Old     (99Bison)      Join Date: Sep 2012       08-12-2015, 10:36 AM Reply   
The big difference in those properties I see is mom's property is on the inside of the cove shape, while your property is the opposite it curves out. That would be main concern on actually keeping a beach and not just eroding your entire property away. For example (more erosion prone that yours) there was a decent sized peninsula near our place that has virtually disappeared without much change in water level. Just this year it was semi rebuilt - at least to not shrink further and added riprap around all of it except the very inside curve.

What do the other properties on your shoreline look like are they retaining wall less, etc?

Last edited by 99Bison; 08-12-2015 at 10:43 AM.
Old     (azeus17)      Join Date: Feb 2010       08-12-2015, 12:18 PM Reply   
I want to go the opposite of you. I have 81 feet of frontage that is all sand and want a seawall. Here are the things I hate about the beach:
1. Sand all over the dock
2. Sand in the boat from people not having common sense
3. Sand eroding away from a heavy rain
4. Sand eroding away from f*cking surfers
5. Picking weeds on the beach
6. Having to add more sand to the beach because of #3 and 4
7. Sand in my house

I am sure I could go on, but you get the point, I hate it. Maybe you grew up with it and are used to doing all these things, but I think you said this is a new house for you. There will be lots to keep you busy with a lake house and you will probably regret giving yourself more work in the future.

If you decide to do it, I would say go smaller than you think you need...you can always go bigger later on. Another thing to consider; if you remove the seawall, will the DNR ever let you reinstall another one if you want? I know some states are cracking down on new ones.
Old     (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       08-12-2015, 12:43 PM Reply   
Quote:
if you remove the seawall, will the DNR ever let you reinstall another one if you want?
They will not... they will not allow us to fix existing either .... and the section I had picked was because it was starting to look a little haggard. The photo from the lake you can kinda see where the wall changes color, the lighter color from a prior owner patch job, but its not holding up so well.


Quote:
What do the other properties on your shoreline look like are they retaining wall less, etc?
Its about a 70/30 split of seawalls (most are rock) vs beaches... but the lack of because is mostly because people cannot get a permit for a large enough beach space to make it worth it ... we one of the largest shorelines on the lake (if not thee largest) so we can actually pull it off. Most places have ~70' of frontage so with the 35% rule would be stuck with a 25' wide beach at max... where as we can go up to 115' wide.
Old     (lhlocal)      Join Date: Jun 2003       08-12-2015, 2:44 PM Reply   
We have sand on part of our lakefront and its great. Our kids and all our friends with kids love it. Go basically level with the Lake or a little deeper and then back fill with sand. Hard rains will wash it into the lake, but heavy boat traffic will also wash it back into shore. You also dont want to have kids digging down into rocks, dirt and etc. I put down landscape fabric and regret it. My neighbor didnt. He goes out for 30 minutes on his overgrown beach with a rototiller, does a quick raking and it looks like a million bucks.

For boat parking, I made a form our of plywood. Added three bags of quickcrete and a piece of rebar bent into a half circle and sunk it into the cement. Instant anchor. I put 6' of chain on it with a caribener and a bouy and you have instant boat parking Away from shore and easy to keep an eye on. $30 bucks per boat for parking.Plus you can throw a swim raft or aqua pad on it.

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