I'm not trying to open a "can of worms" here but inclusion, as an example of teachers having their hands tied, may not always be best for all students with or without disabilities as the ACLU proposes. The lady in the incident I've attached withdrew her child form school because the administrator did not know how to properly deal with the autistic child. In some cases, I think inclusion may be a step backward for kids with disabilities but schools are forced to place those children into regular classrooms because Federal law requires this. Any child struggling in school should be able to receive help but then the issue of labeling occurs so the student is forced to sit in a classroom that he/she may not be ready to attend. My friend's son is in school with a kid who throws chairs for no apparent reason and has sudden outbursts of violent rages, and the teacher is left with no other option than to have the students leave the room. After things calm down, from 40 minutes to 2 hours, he's placed right back into the classroom in a day or two I challenge you to visit a public school and talk to the teachers who are largely overburdened with paperwork and regulations.
Oh and if I sound angry in my posts its because I F ing am. This crap is unacceptable and a bunch of gun toting hillbillies are keeping our kids in danger so they can keep their useless dangerous toys. Everyone should be pissed off about this. And if your not, then you must think that this is normal or OK and it is NOT.
Gun control, armed guards isn't really addressing the problem, its just minimizing the damage. The big picture problem is the way we treat each other in society, financial inequality, and general unhappiness. These are much bigger problems and much harder to "solve" but we need to start thinking about them now to try and start moving in the right direction or things are going keep getting worse.
^^^yea so what’s ur point. A 13 year old buys a .22 Seems pretty normal to me. I guess some people he come from a culture where a kid with a .22 is evil. Sorry lots of people grew up with .22 and it was just a slightly bigger version of a BB gun. I guess it’s all “Time & place”. In the city yes a 13year old with a .22 is a Bad Idea. In the country a kid with a .22 well that’s pretty much the norm. So notice how in my example its not the gun that’s the problem, it’s where it’s being used and what kind of person is using it. The same example could be made for Dirt bikes. Dirt bikes are very common for kid in the country to have and they are not a problem. Bring that same dirt bike or ATV to Oakland and NOW ITS A PROBLEM. You guys ever seee the videos where hundreds of kids take over the streets with ATVs and Dirtbikes?
I guess we should ban ATVs and Dirt bikes now
A 13 year old buys a .22 Seems pretty normal to me.
Jesus.
I grew up in rural Wisconsin, kids of any age can go hunting with an adult (and fire the weapon) even if they haven't hunter's safety .... so kids operating and being around fire-arms is normal here; but to say its normal for those kids to BUY a weapon is just stupid... that isn't normal and if that clip isn't wildly edited shows how ****ed up the current system is.
Nick gets it, Grant. I spent every summer in rural Texas handling guns and at younger than 13. The thought that I could have strolled in and BOUGHT one is absurd.
Ok I see your point a minor should not be able to buy a firearm by himself. I’m sure most parents (good ones) would not allow a 13 year old to buy a firearm at a gun show. My point that I’m sure you want to pass over. Is that the major reason we have all this gun violence is the break down in the family UNIT. Crazy’s get their hands on them and use them to kill. Just like when crazy’s get their hands on Jet liners or Trucks they use them to kill.
No one wants to pass that over Grant. There is no doubt in my mind that is a factor.... one of MANY. But what are you going to do legislatively to fix that? What can you do? Social programs, etc? Those are things the right continually wants to pull funding from...
There is a way to make it harder to get guns, right? What is wrong with looking at this avenue as one possible way to cut down on the amount of guns getting into the wrong hands? Why is the right so scared of legislation that will have ZERO effect on them as responsible gun owners?
. Is that the major reason we have all this gun violence is the break down in the family UNIT. Crazy’s get their hands on them and use them to kill. Just like when crazy’s get their hands on Jet liners or Trucks they use them to kill.
Agreed that the family has a lot to do with it ... I think the parents should be the first and last line of defense, but some defense in the middle would help too... as Ian said:
Quote:
What is wrong with looking at this avenue as one possible way to cut down on the amount of guns getting into the wrong hands? Why is the right so scared of legislation that will have ZERO effect on them as responsible gun owners?
Why is this such a bad idea?! Sure parents should be keeping an eye on the home, but if mom and dad are both working 2x jobs to pay the bills and not around as much as they would like to be, it would be nice to know Lil' Johnny can't stroll down to the local gun show and buy himself a new toy.
Crazy did get their hands on Jetliners.... and we got TSA. How many Hijackings in the USA since 9/11? Bad **** happened, we did things to stop it from happening again. A crazy tied to use his shoes to blow up a plane, we take our shoes off now as we pass through TSA.
Normally the disaster flow chart is:
NEW BAD **** HAPPENS --> Figure out measure to limit / stop / monitor so it doesn't happen again --> It happens less / not at all
With Guns the flow chart is:
Terrible **** happens with a gun, again --> NRA / Right-Wing: More rules won't help, lets not even try to stop it, in fact, MORE GUNS --> Bad **** happens again and they seem shocked.
Last edited by sidekicknicholas; 02-21-2018 at 10:31 AM.
Personally i see Zero issues “raising the bar” for people to purchase a fire arms. But this is just me My 2c. What I think gun owners fear is. If they were to “make a Bar” to jump over, that this would be the start of the end. Example they start putting restrictions and TRUST ME this is what they do, they slowly but surely start raising the bar ever so slightly inch by in year by year, more and more restrictions and b4 you know it a perfectly legal citizen that could walk in and fill out the paper work & do the back ground check & wait the 15 days can No longer purchase a gun. That’s how these laws work. The anti gun movement plays “the long game” their goal is to slowly and quietly year by year inch by inch take away. I think the NRA has a stance to NO to everything. Don’t let the anti gun crowd get a foot in the door EVER. I don’t feel this way but I know many who do and they have a good point.
Example they start putting restrictions and TRUST ME this is what they do,
You're a few stupid hand gestures away from talking exactly like Trump.
We have a long as way to go before that is even a question... and honestly I don't think there are many liberals who are saying "100% no guns" .... most seem to just want practical checkpoints in the buying process and eliminating fire-arms which have little to no purpose in hunting / personal defense (e.i. fully auto weapons)
Nick I live in california where do you live? Why don’t you tell us all about the gun laws in your state?
We have a pretty stringent gun buying regiment here in Ca.
1. You walk in and you Pay for “in full” what ever gun you want.
2. You fill out all the background check papers.
3. The Gun shop sends in a background check &15 days later the gun shop gives you a call and says you can either come pick up your gun or come get your money back cause you failed the back ground check.
4. You need to show the gun shop (with a receipt) that you own a gun safe.
5. You need to fill out a gun safety questionnaire .
6. You need to transport your gun in a Locked Case from the gun shop to your home.
7. Your ammo can’t be in the same space as your gun ever.
8. We can’t possess mags that hold more then 10 rounds. And our AR’s are retarded.
Ok these are just a few the the Rules we law abiding gun owners MUST obey to obtain a fire arm. Nick why don’t you tell us about what great laws your state has to prevent gun violence. I will be waiting
I live in california where do you live? Why don’t you tell us all about the gun laws in your state?
We have a pretty stringent gun buying regiment here in Ca.
Only six states (California, Colorado, Illinois, New York, Oregon and Rhode Island) require universal background checks on all firearm sales at gun shows, including sales by unlicensed dealers. Three more states (Connecticut, Maryland and Pennsylvania) require background checks on all handgun sales made at gun shows.
So, pretty much, anyone in America can buy a gun legally. Both sides agree that bad guys should Not have guns. Both sides agree that Not everyone in the US has a right to own a firearm. Let's start by Not selling guns to bad guys every where in the US!
contrary to your liberal beliefs, it is 100% possible to be honest and observant of sociological facts while being able to treat individuals with respect
who am I (or anyone for that matter) to judge a random individual based on group statistics?
When I was growing up everyone we knew had guns and learned to shoot at a early age. The handling and respect of a firearm was bred into us I guess. My immediate family was not hunters and we lived in the suburbs. There was no social media and 24hr live news when I was young but I don't remember hearing about schools getting shot up. Was it out there? True more guns equals more opportunity and a firearm is a tool made by men which is useless unless in the hands of a person making a conscious decision to act. In my opinion there has been a societal change from hunting rifles in pick up truck windows nobody would ever think to steal or use to shoot up a school to readily available military grade hardware and enabling behavior that has devolved moral character and fiber to a level that processes these type of things with regularly.
Should I really need to shop Kevlar book bags for my kids? Why is that even a viable business!.
The direct loss of profit comes because closing the current gaping loophole in the background check system will shut off sales to criminals and the mentally ill who are effectively free to buy all the guns they want at gun shows and through private transactions.
But there is also an indirect loss of profit: Cutting off sales to the mentally ill and criminals will reduce crime and thereby reduce the public's demand for guns for self-protection.
The gun manufacturers saw gun sales plummet during the dark days of the Clinton administration when crime dropped sharply every year. The 42% drop in the murder rate from 1993 to 2000 was a nightmare for gun sellers. Nothing scares the NRA as much as a sense of calm and safety in the public.
Fear is great for their bottom line.
From 2008 to 2013, the gun and ammo manufacturing industry had one of the stronger periods in its history, with revenue growing at an annual rate of roughly 8.4% to an estimated $14.7 billion in 2013, according to a report on the industry by research firm IBISWorld. The report’s authors concluded that gains for the industry were driven in part by anxiety among its customers. “Fear of a potential rise in crime contributed to unprecedented industry growth,” the report stated. (In fact, nationwide, both property and violent crime rates fell over this period, according to FBI data.)
The impact of fear on gun sales was clear in the aftermath of the terrorist attacks on Sept. 11, 2001. The number of criminal background checks for firearm purchases — considered a good proxy for gun sales — jumped 22% in September of 2001 over the previous month’s levels, and another 19% that October.
As far as the age old of an 18 yr old can serve his country bs argument goes ...........that 18 yr old is put through months of mental and physical training in order to handle that weapon. They are watched closely and ultimately “approved “ for duty after a rigorous training regiment of the body and mind . They don’t just decide they want a rifle today and walk out with one like magic . Those deemed unqualified are also bounced ... I personally think if someone wants an AR or any variant they should be mandated to take a course with some substance , and “prove their worth “ and mental capacities. It’s also clear again that the agency so heavily involved in allegedly protecting us (FBI) has yet again dropped the ball on failing to act on warning signs . Again proving the items are in place to stop some of these craz’s.
Right now it’s next to impossible to track and maintain guns , because a majority of each states have their own laws and requirements. I see no reason why conceal carry and gun laws shouldn’t be a nationalized program , That would ultimately lead to a much leveler playing field , and give a huge advantage of collecting data and keeping laws and regulations on an even playing field .
I don’t understand how the left makes an instant link to gun laws for any shooting , yet fails to connect the dots on the fact the educational and mental health systems are failing miserably by producing more and more individuals with “mental issues “ . It’s absurd to place the blame entirely on a piece of metal. At some point you have to take a look at why so many of these individuals are imerging on a regular basis. The access to guns has remained the same , so translating more shootings directly as a results of lax gun laws is asinine , It’s clearly a bigger problem than guns
Last edited by xstarrider; 02-22-2018 at 12:09 AM.
I don’t understand how the left makes an instant link to gun laws for any shooting , yet fails to connect the dots on the fact the educational and mental health systems are failing miserably by producing more and more individuals with “mental issues “ . It’s absurd to place the blame entirely on a piece of metal. At some point you have to take a look at why so many of these individuals are imerging on a regular basis. The access to guns has remained the same , so translating more shootings directly as a results of lax gun laws is asinine , It’s clearly a bigger problem than guns
100% agree but solving those types of problems takes social investment and time. You need to send money on education and mental health services and wait until the changes roll out. In the short term you can lesson the damage by restricting gun ownership.
...yet fails to connect the dots on the fact the educational and mental health systems are failing miserably by producing more and more individuals with “mental issues “ .
Why don't you help us and connect the dots. How is it the educational system is producing mentally ill people? And for that matter how does the mental health system "produce" mentally ill people? It's my understanding that mentally sound people don't use that service. Of course there is that ADHD thing where they are drugging kids. Maybe that's what you are referring to.
Why don't you help us and connect the dots. How is it the educational system is producing mentally ill people? And for that matter how does the mental health system "produce" mentally ill people? It's my understanding that mentally sound people don't use that service. Of course there is that ADHD thing where they are drugging kids. Maybe that's what you are referring to.
The educational system is consistently making excuses for those problem individuals. The educational system has been ramming home the fact you are owed things because you are a “victim” . It’s not your fault , it’s someone else’s. The educational system has gone down the crapper . Values ( gone) actual educcation( gone) , teachers can’t keep students in check any longer for fear of losing their jobs , classroom disruptions are at an all time high, an “ all inclusive “ classroom atmosphere is a learning environment nightmare . School walk outs , and political actions are rammed down young people throats . They are so slanted it’s not even funny . The lack of accountability , lack of structure , lack of actual reference is disgusting . Couple all that with social media outlets and the continued bias news media reports and you’re brreding more and more individuals with no sense of direction and plenty of outlets to find a likeminded group. Kids are more medicated these days than ever. Ever been inside a school and actually seen the nurse’s office filled with kids daily meds? The ADHD bull crap is about the most bull**** diagnosis you can muster . How about be a parent, allow the teachers to to control their classrooms , keep the problem kids together and structure a program like the used to.
Ever seen what a single teacher has to do for every student nowadays regarding a lesson plan ? It’s physically impossible to actuallly focusing on teaching because they have so much bull**** to contend with. Classroom environments are awful . Case in point my daughters classroom environment. They have 1 single behavioral “teacher “ for the entire k-6 school . She has 3 “problem “ kids in her single classroom alone. (3 grade level classeooms for each grade) 2 Consistenly interupt classroom events on a daily basis. ,it’s been as bad as chairs and desks flying , outbursts of screaming , tearing up classroom books and homework . What can the teacher do ????? Absolutely nothing. The administration won’t suspend , discipline , or remove the kids from the classroom because these kids are “entitled “ to the same education with their “disabilities”. So 15 other kids suffer why these kids get every excuse in the book ?
The definition of “mentally ill “ is also up for discussion. It’s not necessarily “ crazy “ in the sense of One Flew Over the Coo-Coo’s nest , but more along the lines of missing core values, lacking enstilling a sense self worth, and personal responsibilities being basically gone . Kids today are in an “you’re owed “ environment . The government was/is pushing the everyone “deserves” agenda . Plain and simple. I ask what has actually been “adjusted more “ in the most recent years , the educational system , or gun laws? Between bathrooms , curriculum , and socialist ideology being taught , which is having a more profound impact? The entitlement mantra is at an all time high. A majority of kids are taught they are owed something by simply existing . Kids are also taught if the dont like it and don’t get what they want its ok to pout and stomp your feet til you get it. Hell lots of adults feel the same way. It’s absolutely sickening. If you don’t think these ideas and environments are producing the outcomes now seen on a daily basis you’re part of the problem. It’s alarming clear on what’s the culprit here. It’s sure as **** ain’t the changing of gun laws. With that said I am all for enacting gun legislation , but my reason, like many other like minded people in America , isn’t because the guns are bad and evil .
In Florida (your home state ) what gun laws have been changed in last 8yrs??? Now go back and look at what changes have happened to educational system and what has been stripped and/or added to/ from the school environments ? Yes it’s that simple .
The educational system is consistently making excuses for those problem individuals. The educational system has been ramming home the fact you are owed things because you are a “victim” . It’s not your fault , it’s someone else’s. The educational system has gone down the crapper . Values ( gone) actual educcation( gone) , teachers can’t keep students in check any longer for fear of losing their jobs , classroom disruptions are at an all time high, an “ all inclusive “ classroom atmosphere is a learning environment nightmare . School walk outs , and political actions are rammed down young people throats . They are so slanted it’s not even funny . The lack of accountability , lack of structure , lack of actual reference is disgusting . Couple all that with social media outlets and the continued bias news media reports and you’re brreding more and more individuals with no sense of direction and plenty of outlets to find a likeminded group. Kids are more medicated these days than ever. Ever been inside a school and actually seen the nurse’s office filled with kids daily meds? The ADHD bull crap is about the most bull**** diagnosis you can muster . How about be a parent, allow the teachers to to control their classrooms , keep the problem kids together and structure a program like the used to.
This sounds like a lot of whiner B.S., and isn't anything like the public schools my kids went to in a state that consistently rates at the absolute bottom of every education system ranking.
Quote:
Originally Posted by xstarrider
So 15 other kids suffer why these kids get every excuse in the book ?
hahahahaha so wait a minute... you are complaining about a classroom with 16 kids in it?! LOLz!
Quote:
Originally Posted by xstarrider
The definition of “mentally ill “ is also up for discussion. It’s not necessarily “ crazy “ in the sense of One Flew Over the Coo-Coo’s nest , but more along the lines of missing core values, lacking enstilling a sense self worth, and personal responsibilities being basically gone . Kids today are in an “you’re owed “ environment . The government was/is pushing the everyone “deserves” agenda . Plain and simple. I ask what has actually been “adjusted more “ in the most recent years , the educational system , or gun laws? Between bathrooms , curriculum , and socialist ideology being taught , which is having a more profound impact? The entitlement mantra is at an all time high. A majority of kids are taught they are owed something by simply existing . Kids are also taught if the dont like it and don’t get what they want its ok to pout and stomp your feet til you get it. Hell lots of adults feel the same way. It’s absolutely sickening. If you don’t think these ideas and environments are producing the outcomes now seen on a daily basis you’re part of the problem. It’s alarming clear on what’s the culprit here. It’s sure as **** ain’t the changing of gun laws. With that said I am all for enacting gun legislation , but my reason, like many other like minded people in America , isn’t because the guns are bad and evil .
So who is going to administer your socialist ideology entitlement test before denying a constitutional right? How you gonna administer that? What happens when acceptance and repetition of fake news is deemed to be "mentally ill"? When rejection of science is deemed to be mentally ill? You gonna be OK with denial of due process and search and seizure of Breitbart readers' homes too?
Quote:
Kids are also taught if the dont like it and don’t get what they want its ok to pout and stomp your feet til you get it.
I really feel sorry for you if you live in a place where this is really true (not where your media perveyor of choice tells you it's true). Not my experience at all. My kids and their friends are out there kickin' ass and making the world a better place. I hope yours will too.
The educational system is consistently making excuses ... Yes it’s that simple .
OK, let's assume that xstarrider is right, he's NOT but lets play anyways.
The education system is to blame and is creating killers. So if we fix the system, those killers are already out there it will be what 6 more years of monthly shootings before the "fixed education" clears out the crazy kids.
so that will be conservatively only another 6*12= 72 school shootings?
OR we could take away the weapons that allow the school destruction to be so easily executed.
Take away their ability to easilly access the guns and it can stop NOW.
I'm sure that SWATGUY thinks the 72 more school shootings is a small price to pay to be able to continue hording guns that make him feel safe and is as effective as a teddy bear makes my daughter feel safe but I don't.
The Florida shooting proved that armed guards aren't effective, since they had one. The vegas shooting proved that more guns doesn't fix anything. If half the population on earth was shot by an AK, it still wouldn't be enough for the NRA to say that maybe the guns are the problem because their goal is to sell more guns and they've convinced a small amount of Americans that Keeping guns is the only thing that matters and they will vote and donate based on only that issue so they are keeping the rest of us hostage.
As to Grant point that we were silent when the shooter shot up the Republican baseball game. Honestly, I was hoping that might change some of their minds, but nope, money is still more important to the republican congress.
I don’t understand how the left makes an instant link to gun laws for any shooting , yet fails to connect the dots on the fact the educational and mental health systems are failing miserably by producing more and more individuals with “mental issues “ . It’s absurd to place the blame entirely on a piece of metal. At some point you have to take a look at why so many of these individuals are imerging on a regular basis. The access to guns has remained the same , so translating more shootings directly as a results of lax gun laws is asinine , It’s clearly a bigger problem than guns
Both are a problem and the right has consistently kept the left from funding mental health and education and kept us from enacting sensible gun laws.
Its just like the fire triangle. You need oxegen, fuel and spark to have a fire. Take one away and it won't happen.
For mass shooting you need a lunatic and a gun. take either away and it won't happen. What is easier to take away?
I don’t understand how the left makes an instant link to gun laws for any shooting , yet fails to connect the dots on the fact the educational and mental health systems are failing miserably by producing more and more individuals with “mental issues “ . It’s absurd to place the blame entirely on a piece of metal. At some point you have to take a look at why so many of these individuals are imerging on a regular basis. The access to guns has remained the same , so translating more shootings directly as a results of lax gun laws is asinine , It’s clearly a bigger problem than guns
Isn't it just like blaming stoners on weed? We regulate "stuff" all the time because of what we trust (or don't trust) the stupidest/weakest/dumbest among us to do with that stuff.
If the issue isn't guns, but rather mental health, what are you (being a card carrying representative of "the right") doing to keep guns out of the hands of the people with "mental issues?"
I agree, let's release all the marijuana and drug offenders from jail and start filling them up with violent criminals instead. I don't have a problem with that at all. Make it hurt to get caught with an illegal firearm.
Ok these are just a few the the Rules we law abiding gun owners MUST obey to obtain a fire arm. Nick why don’t you tell us about what great laws your state has to prevent gun violence. I will be waiting
Quote:
Nick thanks for not answering the question but telling us everything. We get it You know nothing
I literally didn't post at all between your two statements above .... so no clue what you're talking about.... so maybe take a deep breath, read the actual thread, then start commenting again. Second, WE AGREED ABOVE.... We were on the same page. I can only assume some sort of medication wore off between your posts.
I currently live in Wisconsin .... my point about tougher laws above should have nothing to do with the state level, The federal regulations need the change because, and perhaps you didn't realize this, it is possible to buy a firearm in another state. Cali could pass a "NO GUN SALES" act, stopping all sales, but a short trip East means none of that matters.
Since, and I quote
Quote:
Personally i see Zero issues “raising the bar” for people to purchase a fire arms. But this is just me My 2c.
...this needs to happen at the federal level and if states want to go further, cool... if not, at least the collective bar was raised.
If the issue isn't guns, but rather mental health, what are you (being a card carrying representative of "the right") doing to keep guns out of the hands of the people with "mental issues?"
Well, looks like so far most of those card carrying members in congress and Trump by signing into law the repeal of a measure that would have plausibly prevented certain classes of mentally ill people from purchasing firearms by allowing a new data source to be included the system that runs those background checks.
Nick the thing that gets me going is this. Dumb A$$ libs that don’t know $hit that come off as know it all’s when it comes to guns. You sounded like one so that’s why you got my attention. Here is a Example, I already live in one of the most gun restrictive states, then dumb ass people libs start piping up like “whack a mole” saying we need more laws and more restriction, and yes here is the kicker. You regulate the $hit out of Californians, 15 day wait and back ground check,bla bla bla but you can get in your car drive to Nevada 2 hrs away and I’m 100% serious in my next statement you can pick up the news paper in Nevada go to the “for sale section” and buy a used AR/15 from a guy out of the back of his car in the parking lott of Walmart. And own and possesses many high capacity mags as you want. Zero paperwork cash and cary! So you dumb dumbs who want regulation start with fixing stuff like that.
Mean while have you seen what brilliant law makers have made Californian AR15 owners do. They have made us jump threw more and more hoops and it’s 100% useless. Example https://youtu.be/wN4QNTaZ0y8
but you can get in your car drive to Nevada 2 hrs away and I’m 100% serious in my next statement you can pick up the news paper in Nevada go to the “for sale section” and buy a used AR/15 from a guy out of the back of his car in the parking lott of Walmart.[/url]
Private gun sales are definitely possible in NV. You aren't going to pick up a paper tho... craigslist ate classifieds in Nevada long ago. And CL and FB marketplace don't allow gun sales. I'm sure there must be some sites that support gun classifieds in Nevada, but it certainly isn't the usual suspects as you suggest.
Well, looks like so far most of those card carrying members in congress and Trump by signing into law the repeal of a measure that would have plausibly prevented certain classes of mentally ill people from purchasing firearms by allowing a new data source to be included the system that runs those background checks.
Not really true tho... Trump repealed a reg that would've shared social security disability info for purposes of background checks. I'm personally not sure that I want civil rights to be denied to a person who has depression.
The whole "mental illness" thing is a razor's edge to walk. To the extent you stigmatize it, and deny civil rights for seeking treatment, you may discourage people from seeking treatment which just exacerbates the problem of lots of untreated mental illness.
Personally I think "mental illness" is a red herring (but an oh so beautifully crafted one). The argument is basically that as soon as an Orlando or Las Vegas or Parkland happens that only a "sick" and "mentally ill" person could do such a horrific act, ergo the problem is mental illness not guns. Problem being that none of those guys were ever formally diagnosed to be mentally ill, and certainly not ruled by a court to be legally incompetent. It's that the horror of the bad act itself is the basis for the diagnosis.
John; I love how you libs love to play the victim. Oooo who is me! Your god OBOZO was president for 8 years, you guys had the majority and What? You still couldn’t get $hit done as far as gun control. My state CA seems to be getting more rules and more and more guns placed on the “Can’t Own List” so don’t tell me you can’t pass gun reform laws, your full of $hit like normal. I LIVE IN A STATE that’s been doing that very thing for years. This is my point. They very dumb ass people like John that come off like they know everything and they don’t know ****. If your complaining about lack of gun control laws and you Live in a state with none “MOVE Out of it” go to Gun Free Democrat controlled Detroit. Live among the people you champion for. LOL LOL
John; I love how you libs love to play the victim. Oooo who is me! Your god OBOZO was president for 8 years, you guys had the majority and What? You still couldn’t get $hit done as far as gun control. My state CA seems to be getting more rules and more and more guns placed on the “Can’t Own List” so don’t tell me you can’t pass gun reform laws, your full of $hit like normal. I LIVE IN A STATE that’s been doing that very thing for years. This is my point. They very dumb ass people like John that come off like they know everything and they don’t know ****. If your complaining about lack of gun control laws and you Live in a state with none “MOVE Out of it” go to Gun Free Democrat controlled Detroit. Live among the people you champion for. LOL LOL
Grant, two posts ago you pointed out the whole problem with the argument in this post ... that until gun laws are uniform across all states, people will travel to a nearby jurisdiction with more lax laws.
different topic but same point... I heard elko county NV was considering approval of its first rec/med MJ dispensary... in West Wendover, NV. Where's that? Why it's right across the state line from UT, where all forms of MJ are still illegal.
John; I love how you libs love to play the victim. Oooo who is me! Your god OBOZO was president for 8 years, you guys had the majority and What? You still couldn’t get $hit done as far as gun control. My state CA seems to be getting more rules and more and more guns placed on the “Can’t Own List” so don’t tell me you can’t pass gun reform laws, your full of $hit like normal. I LIVE IN A STATE that’s been doing that very thing for years. This is my point. They very dumb ass people like John that come off like they know everything and they don’t know ****. If your complaining about lack of gun control laws and you Live in a state with none “MOVE Out of it” go to Gun Free Democrat controlled Detroit. Live among the people you champion for. LOL LOL
This is priceless. You calling someone dumb? Are you not the dumbass that posted an article outraged because Obama's grandmother was going to receive $180K a year for life? Are you not the dumbass that can't spell on a third-grade level?
The only victims here are the innocent people that were gunned down senselessly in that school. Yet, the right's logic is more guns will make us safer. That worked wonders in Las Vegas. This is no longer about Constitutional rights; it's ensuring gun and ammo manufacturers exceed current profits.
Not to mention that there was nothing in what I posted that is remotely relevant to someone playing the victim. It's like he doesn't even understand what he's responding to and simply takes some right wing media provided cliche and posts it as a response.
How did we get from "Obama's coming to take your guns" to "Obama did nothing to your guns" coming out of the same mouths in such a short time?
right, so let's eliminate those loopholes and have a baseline federal gun policy that all states have to adhere to. Private and gun show sales should have to be held to the same standard as the rest. Honestly, most libs are just asking for something! something to move forward in protecting our children. But the NRA and gun nuts always immediately jump out to defend any and all possible legislation against guns.
Owning a gun is according to the 2008 SCOTUS an individual right for the first time in over 200 years. Just because a person is mentally ill, their rights cannot be denied except through due process. But for some reason proponents of that individual right don't seem to grasp that their wish for such a right means the terrorists and mentally ill get their guns as a right until something bad happens.
"..but my reason, like many other like minded people in America , isn’t because the guns are bad and evil ."
Good thing you thew in the quintessential gun lovers strawman or I'd feel like something is missing.
"It’s sure as **** ain’t the changing of gun laws. With that said I am all for enacting gun legislation "
I'm usually not for enacting legislation that doesn't change any laws. But those guys in Congress do need some busy work because they aren't earning their pay right now.
Where were these self imposed Gun Control advocates that are swarming like flys here on W/W , when the Libtard Left wing Berni Bro gunned down the Republicans at the Softball Game????? Crickets. No one cares what you hypocrites think or march about. You want nation wide gun Registration like what we have here in Ca. As a Californian I say Sure “Jump In the pool the water is fine” but I also respect people’s right to be against it. Because we all know the current laws we have here in Ca are a joke. Did any of you total dong tard ain’t gun idiots see the video I posted. These same dong tard Democrats that think they are gonna save the world with more laws
Where were these self imposed Gun Control advocates that are swarming like flys here on W/W , when the Libtard Left wing Berni Bro gunned down the Republicans at the Softball Game????? Crickets. No one cares what you hypocrites think or march about. You want nation wide gun Registration like what we have here in Ca. As a Californian I say Sure “Jump In the pool the water is fine” but I also respect people’s right to be against it. Because we all know the current laws we have here in Ca are a joke. Did any of you total dong tard ain’t gun idiots see the video I posted. These same dong tard Democrats that think they are gonna save the world with more laws
Clearly, it's the clintons' fault. And Carter's. And the hippies.
More liberal “anti -gunners” doing exactly the opposite of what they preach. Releasing violent gun offenders at an alarming rate back to the community
Just a small tidbit
Over a nearly four-month period in 2016, judges gave out cash-based bonds in nearly 96 percent of felony gun cases and released just 2 percent on electronic monitors. In the 10 weeks after the bond order took effect in September, though, the number of cash-based bonds for gun cases plummeted to about 40 percent, while those freed on the electronic bracelets jumped to 22 percent.
The amount set for bonds also sharply fell on average, from nearly $134,000 in 2016 to almost $22,000 in 2017, according to the analysis.
OK, let's assume that xstarrider is right, he's NOT but lets play anyways.
The education system is to blame and is creating killers. So if we fix the system, those killers are already out there it will be what 6 more years of monthly shootings before the "fixed education" clears out the crazy kids.
so that will be conservatively only another 6*12= 72 school shootings?
OR we could take away the weapons that allow the school destruction to be so easily executed.
Take away their ability to easilly access the guns and it can stop NOW.
I'm sure that SWATGUY thinks the 72 more school shootings is a small price to pay to be able to continue hording guns that make him feel safe and is as effective as a teddy bear makes my daughter feel safe but I don't.
The Florida shooting proved that armed guards aren't effective, since they had one. The vegas shooting proved that more guns doesn't fix anything. If half the population on earth was shot by an AK, it still wouldn't be enough for the NRA to say that maybe the guns are the problem because their goal is to sell more guns and they've convinced a small amount of Americans that Keeping guns is the only thing that matters and they will vote and donate based on only that issue so they are keeping the rest of us hostage.
As to Grant point that we were silent when the shooter shot up the Republican baseball game. Honestly, I was hoping that might change some of their minds, but nope, money is still more important to the republican congress.
Since I am wrong and you’re obviously right .........what do you and the other anti gunners contribute to the sudden increase in armed violence and now school shootings??????
Last edited by xstarrider; 02-23-2018 at 12:52 PM.
Since I am wrong and you’re obviously right .........what do you and the other anti gunners contribute to the sudden increase in armed violence and now school shootings??????
A combination of education, society, the media, social media, the fact that this country is morally bankrupt enough to elect a president who makes fun of handicapped people and cheats on his wife with porn stars, who knows. And why don't we know? Because the NRA and the GOP have passed laws that prohibit the Government from studying gun violence. Thanks to their desire to keep everyone ignorant we won't know for sure for years.
In any case, all of the things that might be causing the issue are very long term problems that need to be dealt with in the long term. In the mean time, how can we stop the violence TODAY? The left is proposing a solution. What is your solution?
I'd like to think that none of us here on either side of the issue are personally contributing to the sudden increase in armed violence or school shootings. Did you mean what do we attribute the increase to?
Maybe this teacher should focus on teaching our future generations better grammar instead of shooting herself in the leg with her concealed weapon... Yeah let's get more guns in schools!
If your contention is that the ready access to guns does not contribute to gun violence but it's purely a mental health issue, what is it about America's mental health that makes it worse than every other western country? What are you doing differently than every other country?
If your contention is that the ready access to guns does not contribute to gun violence but it's purely a mental health issue, what is it about America's mental health that makes it worse than every other western country? What are you doing differently than every other country?
Have you seen the demographics of America compared to the rest of these western countries you want to use as comparisons. Yes it’s that simple . A majority of violence occurs in certain areas. Who’s saying it’s related soley to mental health issues? That’s the lefts argument not the rights . That’s their common return to push that trump eliminated a mental health portion of the bill. The common focus on a minute parcentage we consistently see in order to push an agenda. Of the most recent shooters ...... which of them would have actually been prohibited as being labeled “mentally ill “ in a provision of the law?
Who’s saying it’s related soley to mental health issues? That’s the lefts argument not the rights
Errr, you are dumb dumb.
Quote:
Originally Posted by xstarrider
I don’t understand how the left makes an instant link to gun laws for any shooting , yet fails to connect the dots on the fact the educational and mental health systems are failing miserably by producing more and more individuals with “mental issues “
Hybrid Mode
