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-   -   Epic mod thread (http://www.wakeworld.com/forum/showthread.php?t=776294)

05-25-2010 10:15 AM

NIce Brian!

_vitty_ 05-25-2010 1:35 PM

Next time any of you go out could you turn all of your audio off and put the throttle to roughly 1100-1400 RPM and see if you notice a high pitched noise. It almost sounds like a squealing coming from in the water. I am worried its my prop shaft squealing. Only does it in that RPM range though. Otherwise I don't hear it. Maybe this is normal?

fuzzball147 05-25-2010 3:20 PM

I live in east central Illinois and usually ride on Clinton Lake. It is the one from Wisconsin, it was Jessica Oswald's team boat for her wakesurfing. I have been riding in my best friends 21V for the past several years (which is an awesome boat) but I really love this boat.

joesell 05-25-2010 4:59 PM

Brian, how did she weight the boat for surfing?

I keep thinking we have the best wake, but then we tweak something and it gets better.

I've been to Clinton a few times for a hydrofoil event. Usually in mid to late Aug. That's a sweet lake for sure.

05-25-2010 7:09 PM

GUYS ! It is off the assembly line and being LAKE TESTED TOMORROW !!!! YES...!!! 2011 23V going to be on a truck on Thursday and headed to me.....SO PUMPED! Just had to let you all know. When it hits the driveway I will pull out the camera and take pictures to post. CAN NOT HARDLY stand it!

fuzzball147 05-26-2010 2:30 AM

Joe, she loaded the front and left all the way and had the people sit on that side as well. It was pretty impressive...

olmoomba 05-26-2010 9:20 AM


Originally Posted by _vitty_ (Post 1589175)
Next time any of you go out could you turn all of your audio off and put the throttle to roughly 1100-1400 RPM and see if you notice a high pitched noise. It almost sounds like a squealing coming from in the water. I am worried its my prop shaft squealing. Only does it in that RPM range though. Otherwise I don't hear it. Maybe this is normal?

I am assuming you have tried this with the neutral button and revs only mode? If not try that to further eliminate anything else.

Does it do this all the time now or only when you first put it in the water?

When on the trailer turn the prop by hand, does it have a grind feel, is it smooth rotation?

I ask all this because right now w/o any other info, it sounds like it might be your strut bearing.

_vitty_ 05-26-2010 9:32 AM

Hey Fred,
I didn't think to try putting it in neutral at the same rpm. Good thinking. I will try that this evening. When the boat is on the trailer I cant turn the prop by hand to save my life. It has done it since I got the boat last fall.

olmoomba 05-26-2010 10:23 AM

maybe when you lift it out of the water you can try to spin the shaft? if you are trying it when it is dry good luck.

The sound you are describing, from 3000miles away, sounds like the bearing is not getting water to provide lubrication to the strut bearing. I have made the mistake in the past on my first boat of engaging the transmission when on the trailer and it makes a high pitched squeal.

You might also check your packing supply hose, if there is a leak it will suck in air and possibly whistle.

How about abnormal vibration at the same time?

Also keep in mind the throttle body butterfly will make a high pitched noise as well, more like a turbine whistle, that is caused by the velocity of the intake air through the narrow butterfly opening. Really prominent during acceleration.

_vitty_ 05-26-2010 11:35 AM

This is definitely a squeal as compared to a whistle. I don't get any abnormal vibrations. Maybe it is nothing worth worrying about.

_vitty_ 05-27-2010 8:59 AM

It does not do it when the engine is revved in neutral. Only when the prop is engaged.

05-27-2010 9:30 AM

ICE and JOE where ya been, out riding I hope. Just haven't see you around.

joesell 05-27-2010 2:48 PM

I still check in, but we have been out a lot lately. What day are you getting yours?

usostyle 05-27-2010 8:08 PM

busy w/work ,graduation season, HS state finals (track, baseball)...Life...u know the drill...Unfortunately, no riding here, the weather has sucked for like 3-4 weeks straight....gearing up to get out this weekend if the weather cooperates...Give Gary some crap for me when you go get your boat!

05-27-2010 8:25 PM

I talked to Gary today, it is getting on a Truck on Monday (holiday) and should be here Weds if I don't go pick it up. I can meet him halfway and get it tuesday. I am so ready to ride I can hardly stand myself. Can't wait till this time next week.

olmoomba 05-27-2010 11:22 PM

Nic-time to start hunting. I suggest you get in the water under the boat while underway to properly locate the issue…Hahaha…have someone drive the boat while you dig in the hatches trying to find exactly where the noise is coming from. Also you should be able to rotate the prop when on the trailer, especially right after you get out of the water. It will be tough at first but it may give an idea of what is going on. You really need to figure out and hopefully eliminate the possibility that it is running gear related. Perhaps a call to OJ will help. All that gear is theirs, packer, strut, shaft(maybe) prop and rudderS.

tuneman 05-28-2010 8:51 AM

Nic, are you sure it's not just a common air intake squeal? Common thing on a lot of boats.

_vitty_ 05-28-2010 9:15 AM

Yeah pretty sure its not an air intake squeal. I will be out quite a bit this weekend and plan on doing some investigating. It almost sounds like the nasty squeal that happens if you were to engage the prop on the trailer, but more muffled as its underwater. Maybe my ears are too sensitive haha.

I saw the other Epic in MN is for sale. Wonder what he is going to pick up instead?

_vitty_ 05-28-2010 8:58 PM

Was out for a bit this evening with the fiance for a nice chill evening on the lake so I was able to snap a couple quick photos of some of the audio upgrades I did to the boat. The XS-650s look like they were made for the boat! Enjoy!


joesell 05-29-2010 5:52 AM

Nic, You really did do a great job on the install. Everything looks perfect!

_vitty_ 05-29-2010 8:36 PM

Thanks Joe! Lot of sweat and man hours went into it that is for sure. It blew everything away at the party cove today with ease. It is really something.

_vitty_ 06-02-2010 9:14 AM

Anyone with a wet sounds 420 in here ever use the aux out? When I connect an aux cable to my aux out on it and then connect the other end of the cable up to a line driver my boat volume drops by about half. Wondering if any of you have tried this?

joesell 06-02-2010 9:54 AM

Nic, There's a gain on the top of the WS-420. I can't remember exactly, but is that for the aux?

joesell 06-02-2010 9:57 AM

Ice, How's the cooler drain working? Did you seal up the hole that goes to the back? I haven't done mine yet, but I will soon.

I'm still using the fat sack pump method. We usually have an extra sac in the left rear corner for surfing, it's no big deal to drain it out. I really do want to do it right one of these days though.

joesell 06-02-2010 9:58 AM

Twitch, How are the trim tabs working? I'm dying to hear all about them.

joesell 06-02-2010 9:59 AM

Scott, You get your boat yet? Even my girl was asking about it yesterday. It's got to be coming soon.

Let us know how the Grindwater is.

joesell 06-02-2010 10:14 AM

All, Whatever mods I didn't get done before riding season started are kind of on the back burner now.

I did have a piece of delron machined to fit in place of the tow spool. I have a trick release, for when I foil, I want to put up there. I'm installing it today. I'll of course take some pic's.

I'm still waiting on my buddy to make those step plates. He got super busy at work right after I got him the materials. I never would've thought it would take this long.

I kind of finished the trash hole, for now. I'm not sure if I'm completely satisfied, so I'm going to keep refining it.

I little FYI for everyone. My baffles blew out of my muffler. It's pretty loud, and it makes a terrible racket, but it's OK to run until the new one arrives. I just wanted to let everyone know how awesome Epic was. I sent an e-mail, and almost immediately got a response. As far as I know, they sent out the part the next day.

The reason I'm sharing this is, apparently the muffler manufacturer used some glue to hold in the baffles instead of glassing them in. So it could happen again, and I don't want anyone freaking out when it happens. like I said, it make a pretty loud racket.

They gave me 2 options. the first, and probably the best, was to cut the end off the muffler and remove the baffles completely. It would've made the boat a little louder, but it also would've upped the HP. The second option was to just replace the muffler. I went with option 2. I really wanted to remove the baffles, but I suck at glass work, and the muffler company would only pay for an exchange.

So there you have it, Epic still rocks, and I have a new muffler coming.

06-02-2010 10:36 AM


Ok, after alot of work and nightmares my boat made it on a truck today. I am heading to Dale Hollow Lake Thursday so EPIC is going to deliver it to the Marina down there. That is nice, would love to had it before our trip, but what better place to take the wrapper off a new boat than a boat trip. So, I will be out of WW for a week with her, and have pictures when I get back to post. It was as long road to get here, I was pissy at times and worried at times that I wouldn't have a boat for my BOAT trip. But, Gary made it happen. So big props to EPIC and GARY SMITH. I know he isn't a WWorlder but maybe it will get back to him. Great to finally see it get on a truck and get started East. Joe and the rest I will post when I get home. Like I said most likely not for at least a week. I will hopefully get to run it for MANY MANY hours down there and break her in. Do I need to do anything to break in a new boat?


joesell 06-02-2010 10:50 AM

The break in procedure is in the manual. It pretty much just says to keep it under a certain rpm, but to also vary the rpm for a while. Keep checking the fluids, watch for water in the bilge. Have fun!

_vitty_ 06-02-2010 11:19 AM

Joe, my baffle went out last fall. Sounded like a bearing went to heck on one of the belt pulleys. Was a loud rattle. They got me fixed fast with a simple email and trip to the marina. So far so good on the replacement.

I will take the eq off tonight and see if I spot the gain adjustment. I didn't notice any gain on the top/bottom of the unit....hmm

06-02-2010 11:37 AM

Joe, so I can wakeboard and surf can't I?

olmoomba 06-02-2010 1:24 PM

Scott, last you told me I got the the impression you couldn't do either........OH meant while breaking it in, my bad!!!

Joe - I rode the Grindwater and it is ALOT of fun, very ocean surf feel. I still went back to my regular ocean surf boards, but it rode better than any skim thing I ever rode.

Nic - nice pics - those chips are too greasy and brittle for my boat. I completely rewired my transom speakers according to Fosgates website, which is what you and I decided was the correct way. I think I miswired one of the pairs before. None the less I have brand new 14gauge and it is loud. I need more power and hope to get my new to me amps soon! I have other obligations and I hope they don't have to get rid of them soon.
There are gain adjustments on the 420 on the top, they have rubber dome caps covering them. I have used the aux in and no volume drop, never the out tho.

stuntmonkey 06-02-2010 1:46 PM

Saw a black and white epic heading west on the #1 from Calgary on Monday afternoon, anyone on here?

_vitty_ 06-02-2010 2:01 PM

haha gotta love the bbq chips! I think the sub turned them into crumbs though. The bag was making a ton of noise from the vibration.

The amps are safely packaged and on a shelf in my garage waiting for you. No hurry. They will be there when you are ready. Glad to hear the speakers are now working for you though!

I am going to try to play with the gain today or tomorrow depending on when my boat is finished getting its 20 hour maintenance performed. Looks like the gain is for the INPUT only though so I'm doubting it will help the output. Never know though.

olmoomba 06-02-2010 3:09 PM

could be operator error. Make sure you have the 3.5mm jacks plugged in all the way snug. Just sayin' it happens. lol

06-02-2010 3:47 PM

HA ..... well I can board and surf...allbeit not that great....but yes I ment during the break in period smart ass...lol

joesell 06-02-2010 6:50 PM

Scott, you can ride. You might want to hold off on the extra ballast for a few hours at least.

_vitty_ 06-02-2010 8:43 PM

I agree with Joe, Scott. Feel free to board, but don't fill any ballast. Wake will still be plenty large trust me.

_vitty_ 06-02-2010 8:46 PM

I had the boat at the marina for its 20 hour maintenance and just got it back this evening. I had mentioned to them again about the squeal i thought i was hearing and they determined that the prop shaft was out of alignment. They did a quick alignment, but told me it should really get a full alignment. At any rate I wasn't able to get the boat back on the water tonight BUT I can spin the prop shaft freely now with the boat on the trailer without much effort at all. Prior to their alignment I could grab the prop with both hands and not even get it to budge a bit. I can now spin it with one hand and not much effort. Hopefully I notice some more power as well if it was taking a lot of effort to just spin the shaft. I will report back if the noise is now gone as well after I put it back in the lake tomorrow.

06-03-2010 10:01 AM

Yeah I won't be able to fill the ballast anyway, I can't ride a huge wake yet. I will more than likely fill it just to fill it but not run...just empty it afterward. I have to test everything, although they did lake test my boat which they usually don't. Since it is such a long truck over here. So yeah, I can't wait to ride. Got all new boat, board, and surf board. (Epic, Shane 138, and Darin Shapiro Slaysh) I am so ready to get out on the water and test all this stuff I can hardly type.

I will board and surf, which means I will fill some of the ballast for surfing. Any help on what to fill and how much for a nice surfing set?

pilsner31 06-03-2010 10:06 PM

I was told by Gary to fill the front half full, the rear surf side full, wake plate at about 50%. Any more weight in the front on the surf side the better, it will get you a longer wake. You can play around with the wake plate as well. Lift it for a bigger but shorter wake. Drop it for a smaller but longer wake. As soon as mother nature is off her rag up here, I will get some pics and post them.

joesell 06-04-2010 8:53 AM

Scott, The best setup we found so far is, Front full, surf side full, extra 600# bag in the surf side locker, 1/4 - 3/8 full on non surf side, extra 100# up front(were experimenting with more), trim tab at 1/2, and 11.7mph.

If you can't get the extra 600#(or more) in the surf side locker, don't put anything in the non surf side tank. You really need this boat to lean if you want to surf.

olmoomba 06-04-2010 9:55 AM

Due to lots of boat traffic with big wakes, my surf wake is tame, only waist high. 3/4 rear surf side, 1/4 front and 15% trim tab and near 11mph +/-. Then again I have a different boat, lol.

olmoomba 06-04-2010 9:56 AM

Sometimes I feel like the guy with the beeper in a crowd of cell phones.....

joesell 06-04-2010 12:34 PM

"Is this hotel pager friendly?"

06-08-2010 7:49 PM

OK just rolled home from lake and boat is in driveway....I am so tired I will take pics tomorrow for everyone, but my boat is #1 of the 2011 fleet. I feel pretty good about that. Just cool I guess, but I am so tired from 4 days of lake. Had a blast and boat is crazy nuts!!!

06-09-2010 9:22 AM

Hey guys, gonna clean the boat today and take some pictures to post tonight. Just wondering a few things from you all.
1. How long does it take to fill your ballast tanks usually?
2. Best setup for surfing, as we couldn't get it to work very well...?
3. Best cleaner inside and outside you use?
4. How do you store surfboards, mine won't fit in the rack?

Thanks I know a few are answered already but just to have them all in one place.

Fred, I re-read your post on surfing, I will try that. We didn't think to change the plate to 50%...damn....

joesell 06-09-2010 10:10 AM

10.5 min to fill/empty.
I mentioned above how we do the ballast. I know it sucks to have an extra bag. But if you want the best wake, you need more weight on the surf side.
Get a bucket of babes products. You'll love them. Also, Collinites wax is awesome!
I changed out the forks on one of the racks. I got the surf/wake combo rack from Samson. I've been kicking around maybe getting an endless wave rack from Wake 9 also.

joesell 06-09-2010 10:15 AM

Oh yeah, the tallest wave isn't the best. It needs to push. So use your trim tab to change the wake until you feel it push you.

06-09-2010 10:52 AM

Joe, how did you change one of your racks? I will say that the 2011 racks are a little different than 2009 and lower. I actually got to ride a 2009 for 2 days prior to mine showing up at our cabin. EPIC shipped me a 2009 so I would have a boat for my trip then shipped mine 2 days later sick huh. The only noticable difference is the tower is a bit bigger and the wake racks are a bit different. Everything else is exact.

06-09-2010 11:22 AM

Hey also someone, I would like to get it so that the RADIO comes out ONLY from the transom speakers...do I just use the fader for that? Is there a way to set it up other than that so that only the back has sound? Most of the time for us kids in boat with people, want to talk while someone rides, but rider wants music. Thoughts?

Quiet in boat, yet loud for rider....lol possible?

joesell 06-09-2010 12:05 PM

Scott, I'd have to see a pic of you tower and racks. Are the still Samson? If so, I'm sure you could get the surf fingers.

I added an WS 420, and an HSE. But I think they came wired to you could use the fader to adjust the transom/interior volume. You really should look into those 2 products though. They really are awesome.

06-09-2010 12:14 PM

Cool, I will. Feel like I spent enough money already. =) I have to do the wind dam. Got to find a place for 1/2 plexiglass. To build my dam. I will snap pics tonight. If anyone knows where to get plexi let me know.

joesell 06-09-2010 12:21 PM

Scott, I hear ya, but it never ends. you might as well do all the stuff you want right away. That way you can enjoy it the whole time you own your boat.

06-09-2010 12:42 PM

YUP, I can't believe how expensive plexiglass is. Menards for a .220 thick 48"x96" is $160 a sheet. Don't need near that much but all they sell. Uggg....

joesell 06-09-2010 2:34 PM

Don't buy it there. Look online for a local plastic wholesaler. They have what you need for way, way cheaper.

pilsner31 06-09-2010 5:56 PM

Scott, on mine I just use the fade on the deck to the transom speakers and it works fine. Pounds*out the back for the rider, backround music for the people in the boat.

06-09-2010 9:08 PM

Sorry now pics tonight, had bday party for my 2 year old and just got too late. I will try again tomorrow. I did however sit in it for ten min...drinking a beer with my brother in law... =) Got to have a beer and what better place than a new boat in a driveway!

_vitty_ 06-11-2010 9:29 AM

so where is this new boat?

06-11-2010 10:32 AM

I know I know....sorry guys...just so busy since I got home with work. I am leaving early today and WILL take pics and post tonight late. Sorry..=)

06-11-2010 3:21 PM

New Boat
5 Attachment(s)
here ya go...

06-11-2010 3:25 PM

5 Attachment(s)

06-11-2010 3:26 PM

That is all I have for now....storm is coming...I think the tower racks may be different. I need to talk to Epic to find out if I can get a surf rack too. Thoughts?

06-11-2010 3:27 PM

Oh it was sooooo sunny when I took those. The dash looks fuzzy in the pics but I assure you it is perfect.

06-11-2010 3:28 PM

OH...lol and the FAE is going on soon....Joe I may need to pick your brain on that.

samhanna 06-11-2010 3:55 PM

I see no difference at all in the 2011 and the 2009 besides the racks?? What did they change??

samhanna 06-11-2010 3:57 PM

Oh and get the foam guards for the guide poles ASAP. When you load your boat the pvc will cut into the vinyl decals and never come out. It will be very visible on a black boat. I speak from experience.

_vitty_ 06-11-2010 4:30 PM

Sick Scott!! That is the color scheme I was originally looking to get, but was unable to. Very sharp looking! The towers look the same minus some subtle differences on the racks, the butterfly braces, and it looks slightly wider at the top. Excellent choice man!

06-11-2010 6:42 PM

Sam...yes I agree. Have little mark already, but oh well. I will get something ordered. Any thoughts on where to get the foam gaurds?

2011 is same boat as 2009 really. Minor minor differences but nothing major.

joesell 06-11-2010 10:04 PM

Scott, The FAE is a breeze to install, and worth every penny for sure. I thought they were going to install it for you? I'm sure you can still get some surf fingers for your rack. It's still Samson, They still bolt together.

All, I got my new muffler the other day. I was just about to install it when I decided to put it on the shelf and get some 4", 90deg pipes and delete the muffler all together. It should add some HP, and torque. We'll see how it goes. If it ends up too loud, I'll just put the new muffler on.

olmoomba 06-12-2010 7:54 AM

I would be interested to hear what the boat sounds like without mufflers and with the fae. I can promise you if you go straight pipe out w/o the fae it will be loud, basically like a go fast boat with straight pipes.

traveler 06-12-2010 9:38 AM

Scott, Your new tower is built by Skylon not Samson. At Skylon your tower is known as "Epic 2011 23V" Go online Skylon.com or Talk to Brian "Sales Rep" he'll know exacly what you need. The tubing size on Skylon Towers is slightly different than Samson.

06-12-2010 1:50 PM

Thanks PNC.....how do you know that? You work for them? Joe, yes they were going to put the FAE on when I picked it up at the dealership in Texas however they actually shipped the boat to me instead of Texas on their dime since it wouldn't make it in time for my trip. Again, another thing EPIC did for me to make it all work. They just a very cool people. Amazing. Boat is just crazy nice. I am getting the FAE in the mail soon and have to install, but everyone says super easy. I will look and if I have questions call you. I need a surf rack in place of one of the wake racks for sure, so I may call this Brian guy at Skylon to ask about surf fingers.

joesell 06-12-2010 4:01 PM

Fred, I'll let you know how it goes. I don't think its going to be a problem.

traveler 06-13-2010 12:00 PM

Scott, your FAE will ship out of SD Monday along with your other items, Glad your enjoying your new ride. Yes I work with the Epic Crew. Welcome to the Family!

joesell 06-14-2010 8:53 AM

3 Attachment(s)
I swapped out the muffler for some 4" exhaust pipe. I didn't paint them yet because I wasn't sure if it would work, and they said I could return them if they didn't. I plan on taking it apart in the fall and painting them with spray on bed liner.

Anyway, it was really easy, and it sounds great. I wouldn't recommend this upgrade if you don't have some sort of exhaust extension. It would be way to loud.

06-14-2010 8:56 AM

Joe, so you have a FAE then to cut down some of the noise?

olmoomba 06-14-2010 9:23 AM

Scott, The FAE is mostly for gas emission/dillution. I am guessing a "oh by the way" point is noise reduction as well.

Joe, where I was coming from is when I bought my boat, a partner purchased one at the same time. His had side out exhaust, when I would use his boat, people could hear me coming from around the bend. It is that loud.
My exhaust goes out the bottom of the hull as opposed to the out the transom. Great reduction in noise but vibrates the heck out of the boat when empty and sitting idle. I also could never get away with using aluminized 4" pipe, the brackish water would corrode/errode a hole in that in a matter of weeks, lol.
Your install looks nice and clean!

06-14-2010 12:27 PM

GUYS !!!!

I have the Skylon wake racks and I am taking one set of forks off to put a surf fork. Does anyone have a need for the forks? Would love to get rid of the forks. It is brand new....on the water once. Just not big enough for a surf board. Perfect for wakeboards, look above at the pics....


joesell 06-14-2010 7:44 PM

Scott, I don't have an FAE, I have an exhaust extension that I made from scratch. Like Fred said, it's primary function is to protect the health of my kids. The best side effect is that it also cuts the noise down to almost nothing.

Fred, Your exhaust goes out the bottom of the boat? That's crazy! I've never heard of that. Do you have a picture of the exhaust tubing, and the bottom of the boat? You could get a couple of Stainless elbows if you wanted to.

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