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-   -   Best surf boat 20-21' (http://www.wakeworld.com/forum/showthread.php?t=808847)

tgmind 10-28-2018 6:23 AM

Best surf boat 20-21'
 
I'm on the hunt to find the best 20ft surf boat but I could go up to 21' if needed but 21' even is the max. This rules out a lot of boats that are a little over 21'

I just tested a bunch and wanted to share my opinion for any others in my situation. I surfed behind the Mastercraft X20, Tige RZX20, Tige RZR(my current boat), Malibu 21MLX, and Nautique GS20 all 2018 or 2019 models.

Wave
The Tige RZX20 and Mastercraft X20 make huge waves with stock ballast. The RZR makes a decent wave with stock ballast and gets very nice with added weight. The Nautique and 21MLX both made nice looking waves but had very little push. RZX20 and X20 had the best Waves IMO. Its pretty amazing what kind of wave you can get out of a 20' boat. You do not need a huge boat to make a great surf wave. The sales reps were getting air off the RZX wave with ease and pulling off some cool tricks. The waves are going to be shorter than bigger boats but still plenty long and very fun.

Size
With 102" Beam the RZX20 feels huge inside. The GS20 has 100" beam but feels about the same as the X20 with 98" beam. X20 is much taller and has more storage. The MLX feels plenty big too being a foot bigger than the rest and the RZR is the smallest of the bunch. The RZX and X20 are better at keeping wind spray out of the cabin.

Quality
IMO GS20 wins on quality with X20 right behind or even, then the Tige's and MLX is clearly last. Quality seems to fall pretty well in line with price and to be fair the MLX is a budget boat for Malibu but I was surprised because my old Malibu VLX felt higher in quality and the MLX is basically the same as the new VLX except the bow.

In General I really like my RZR for surfing. The only down sides for me is having to have extra ballast or lots of people to make the best wave and its a little small. It has tons of great features. The New RZX20 has all the same tech but in a huge 20' package for a lot more money. I like all the rear facing seats and 3000lbs stock ballast. The bow rides really high but so does the X20 which leads me to believe this is part of the formula for making a huge wave with a small boat. The X20 is priced similar to the RZX20, Makes an amazing wave, also has lots of really great features and then some. To me it seems higher quality. One of the things I really noticed is how silent it is when you cross a huge wake where the other boats, especially the Malibu seem to shake and rattle. I really like the 2000lbs stock ballast that is all hard tank and still has storage or room to add more weight. 2018 is the last year of X20 and 2019 is the first year of RZX20 FWIW. The GS20 is an awesome boat but its just not great at surfing. The MLX really disappointed me. I had much higher expectation because I really loved my old VLX. The Screens are very nice but thats about all I can say positive.

I would like to test the Supra SR but have not been able to find one. The auto wake feature sounds amazing!

Hope that info helps anyone on the hunt for a similar boat. This is just my opinion of test drives. Maybe the MLX or GS can make a nice wave when dialed in but why not get one that can make a sick wave all stock with ease.

Fixable 10-28-2018 6:58 AM

The SR also has a tiny wave out of the box. I expect that will change a bit when Supra updates it. Right now though, it’s nothing to write home about at all.

This is the last year for the current X20, but the rumor is that it is coming back with the new features from the new X22 and X24. So, it will have the switchback tank, 3k+ stock ballast, 3 minutes fill/empty time, and the new hull design. If it’s anything like the X22, X24, or new XStar, it will be an awesome update.

Also, Nautique has added a pro-ballast feature for the GS series, which is supposed to drastically improve the stock surf wave. (Not sure if the one you demoed had that)

Haven’t been behind a new RZX, but they certainly seem to have done a great job with those boats.

h20king 10-29-2018 3:33 AM

You should demo the centurion fi21 with 4750 lbs of stock ballast I think it will surprise you

tgmind 10-30-2018 3:57 AM

Funny I was just researching that before I came back to this page. Looks like a great boat! I'll have to check it out. From the videos everything looks great except it looks like they are lacking in the control dept with single point of control on the touch screen behind the steering wheel. Would be nice if they had a side screen or some manual switches.

wombat2wombat 10-31-2018 12:27 PM

The MB B52 21' or Tomcat throw a very impressive wave as well.

thejean 11-01-2018 1:35 PM

G21

tgmind 11-02-2018 3:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thejean (Post 1982186)
G21

Can only consider boats that are exactly 21' or less.

SoulSurfer 11-02-2018 7:03 PM

In that case you are really looking for a boat called a 20', as they don't include the swim platform in the nominal length of these boats. For that matter, even a 20 might actually be longer than 21 overall. Platforms tend to be 18 - 24" deep. For example, my MB F22 is only an inch or two short of 24' overall including the platform.

Surfer101 11-02-2018 10:09 PM

The new rzx20 is one of the only 102” beam 20ft boats that are actually 20ft in length plus platform of course. Seen some wave pictures and the wave looks definitely insane.

tgmind 11-03-2018 7:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoulSurfer (Post 1982276)
In that case you are really looking for a boat called a 20', as they don't include the swim platform in the nominal length of these boats. For that matter, even a 20 might actually be longer than 21 overall. Platforms tend to be 18 - 24" deep. For example, my MB F22 is only an inch or two short of 24' overall including the platform.

G21 is 21'6" without platform same with a lot of other boats called 21 but there are some boats like the Malibu 21VLX that are actually 21' exactly without the platform. Some lakes have a 21' restriction where 21' even is okay but cannot be even 1" over. So yes any boat called 20' or any boat that is exactly 21'.

tgmind 11-03-2018 7:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Surfer101 (Post 1982278)
The new rzx20 is one of the only 102Ē beam 20ft boats that are actually 20ft in length plus platform of course. Seen some wave pictures and the wave looks definitely insane.

Yes I got to surf behind the RZX20 a few weeks ago. It is a HUGE 20' boat and the wave with stock ballast is really really nice.

tgmind 11-03-2018 7:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wombat2wombat (Post 1982129)
The MB B52 21' or Tomcat throw a very impressive wave as well.

Those look like nice boats but no dealers within a reasonable distance. One thing that sticks out is the super shallow draft. How do they make these boats with 22" draft when everyone else seems to be 27" or more. Seems like 5+ inches of less water displacement would be a huge downside to making a surf wave.

SoulSurfer 11-03-2018 8:46 AM

The short answer is that draft number isn't correct. 28" would be a more realistic number.

tgmind 11-03-2018 8:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoulSurfer (Post 1982286)
The short answer is that draft number isn't correct. 28" would be a more realistic number.

That makes the most sense.

thejean 11-04-2018 7:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tgmind (Post 1982281)
G21 is 21'6" without platform same with a lot of other boats called 21 but there are some boats like the Malibu 21VLX that are actually 21' exactly without the platform. Some lakes have a 21' restriction where 21' even is okay but cannot be even 1" over. So yes any boat called 20' or any boat that is exactly 21'.



Even the 21í boats that are exactly 21í sometimes arenít, even without the swim platform, due to exhaust pipes, etc.

jhartt3 11-07-2018 7:52 AM

really depends on how your lake measures the boat i assume this is due to a community regulation in my community we measure from the center tip of the nose to the drain plug so even the 21.5 malibu VLX's fit as well as the NXT22. We physically measure we dont go by what the title says.

Mike88 11-07-2018 8:45 PM

You really should take a look at the Nautique 210.
I was in the same situation. Ive changed my 2016 RZR.
Ive tested x20, 21VLX, gs20, SR.
Really love the 2017 supra. Really this boat give tones for the price.

It really depends on your needs and priority.
Malibu’s are really all around boats and made for big crew. People can be 10+ in thť boat and move like they want without even change the wave. But the wave it makes its really ę all around Ľ not much special. Just my own opinion, i really dislike bu’s for that. And the quality is not their force! But for some people it give what they want and im sure they are very satisfied!

Tige is the opposite. Surfwave is amazing but really sensitive. The minute someone move it change the wave. But you can dial it the shape you want and sure you always gonna be able tho dial the perfect wave for everybody. Downside i used to have Many issues with tige’s. Wakeboard like crap too lol.

The GS20 is ok, Nautique quality so by far the best but the surfwave not impressed. Dont really like the GS because this boat want to do too much diversity. You can’t have a boat that surf perfect and slalom perfect its juste impossible lol.. si your stock with a boat that do the 3 main sport OK.

Mastercraft, definitely a Little over priced for what it gives. But that was in 2017. Few changes has and Will be done for 2019 models.

Supra give tons for the monťtaire seriously. Surf system works great and was impress with the stock wave with biggest ballast.
Auto tower a great plus. But lacks a bit on fit and finish for my opinion. Raptor engine are a bit cheaper too i think. Less insulated, cover flaps etc.

Fortunately the supra dealer is Nautique/centurion dealer too.
And when i finished testing the SR for the second time because that was my final choice. A SAN 210 was in the water too and tested it. Really dont regret taking the chance because a bought it.
Fits and finish is nautique quality like all other model they even made the same interior as other for 2018. Deep draft and thats perfect for surfing. And the wave nothing like GS. Just swap the pro ballast fatsac on the rear for 750 and you have a Monster wave for a 21footer.
Back with my rzr i was septical to have a better wave because i was doing the same as you and put additional bags everywhere.
With my 210 every bags are underseat and wave is perfect. Tons of push great transition and you can dial it as you want.
This boat ride like a sport car too, it turn on a dime and accelerate like no other. Really fell in love with this model.
Really found the boat that can be great for surfing great for wakeboard have good built quality and a great engine. 200hours on the clock and not even one recall on anything. First Time it happens to me in almost 10years boating. Not one issue in 200hours.

But i got to admit when im gonna change in 2020 it will be a centurion or supra. 95% sure.
Good luck!

tgmind 11-08-2018 8:33 AM

Oh Man, I cannot believe I overlooked the 210! Now its freezing temps and cannot test until spring. I'm really surprised the dealer did not suggest it when I said the poor wave on the GS was a deal breaker. Look forward to testing it in the spring.

Great write up on your boat opinions.

I'm glad you mentioned weight sensitivity. That is certainly a factor for the X20 and the RZR. I suspect also for the RZX20 although we did not have to shift anyone around when I test rode. Maybe the 102" Beam helps. I suspects its a function of the tab style surf systems with downward water convergence delay verses sideways convergence delay like BU and Nautiique. That is is plus for that style of surf system. The wake of other boats might also have less of an affect on the waves of the Bu and Nautique.

One other thing I noticed during all these test rides and research is the huge difference is dealer experience. Again, when I bought my first new boat I saw all the posts about how important the dealer is but I did not put much concern toward it. Now I see what everyone is talking about. The test ride experience was as great as going out with sales reps that are near pro level and have a ton of knowledge of the boats down to going out with reps that don't ride and really have no idea what they are talking about.

h20king 11-08-2018 9:02 AM

The 210 is a nice boat but not really a surf boat. I rode one at the wake 9 polar bear last month and the push is just not there. Go demo the centurion fi21 you will be blown away. The boat makes an amazing wake for a 21' boat

Fixable 11-08-2018 2:28 PM

The wave sensitivity is from hull design, not from tab system. Deep V’s and modified V’s are much more weight sensitive. So Centurion, Tige, supreme, MB, and some MC’s (X20, X23) are more weight sensitive than boats with a really shallow V like Nautique, Malibu, Supra, and some of the other MC models (new XStar, X22, X24, and the XT series models.

The advantage of the deep/modified V, is that they ride nicer on chop, and they tend to kick up a bigger surf wave on less weight.

Oh, and the 210 is not a good surf boat out of the box.... it doesn’t have nearly enough stock ballast, even with the optional pro ballast. That said, you throw another 2k pounds in that boat, and it kicks an awesome wave.

thejean 11-08-2018 8:38 PM

Best surf boat 20-21'
 
Yet somehow the shallow hull design of the G23 keeps beating out other deep V hull boats for surf boat of the year. My friendís X23 has nowhere near the push of my G23, and he and I both agree on that.

Fixable 11-09-2018 3:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thejean (Post 1982471)
Yet somehow the shallow hull design of the G23 keeps beating out other deep V hull boats for surf boat of the year. My friendís X23 has nowhere near the push of my G23, and he and I both agree on that.

Are you talking about the wakeworld award for surf boat of the year?? Hahaha

Nautique wins that because they email everyone on gods green earth, every year at voting time, to vote for the G23. Funny how Malibu started doing that this year, and all of a sudden the G gets knocked down a peg.

The G23 isnít winning any actual surf events/comparisons like wake 9s events/ surffest, etc.

Gís have a nice wave. I owned 3 of them. I also owned an X23 before the Gs.

While I think the G23 wave is nice enough, and does have really nice push, it definitely would not have been my first choice if I was only looking for a surf boat. I remember wishing I could have kept my X23 wave, and had the G23 wakeboard wake in the same boat.

granddaddy53 11-10-2018 5:44 AM

Seen big mastercrafts on Trailer and G’s 21 and 23, visually nothing seems deeper from gunwhale to bottom of lowest point than the g series sitting on trailer

SoulSurfer 11-10-2018 11:06 AM

How much does a G23 weigh fully ballasted for surfing in comparison to other boats? Except to the extent that it adds weight or weight capacity, the section of the boat from the gunwale down to the water line really shouldn't have anything to do with how powerful of a surf "wave" it makes. That's all about water displacement and then having some control over the shape with which that displaced water comes back together.

thejean 11-12-2018 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoulSurfer (Post 1982558)
How much does a G23 weigh fully ballasted for surfing?.


About 9000 lbs.

Surfer101 11-13-2018 9:27 AM

When the G first came out in 2013 the wave was a game changer. It was the first big boat with a big wave, this says two things. One Nautique did it right in the first place, creating a great boat and and 6 years later not making any major changes. Two, it’s been six years, others have cought up to Nautique and passed their wave capabilities by a mile.

Of we’re comparing weights of the G to its competitors the G is an absolute baby. First let’s talk dry weights, the G isn’t nearly as tall as the rzx, SE, ri237, and weighs a lot less by at least 1000lbs. Yes basically every boat says it weighs 6000lbs online, totally not true. Now let’s talk ballast, most people run a G with about 3200 including added lead, ri237 we’re more like 5500 with lead, tige rzx works best with 4500. So the G is displacing the least amount of weight, therefore creating one of the smallest waves with the top teir tow boats. Now you’re probably thinking why not just add more weight, well Nautique was smart they designed their boat to work best from the factory and just a little bit of lead to offset prop.

thejean 11-18-2018 1:32 PM

Iíve been on the others and the G has plenty of wave and given all of the other benefits Iíd still buy it over a Centurion or Tige. Itís like buying a BMW 3 series over a mustang. Sure the mustang might be faster in a straight line but thatís the only category it would win. Iíd still buy the BMW or Audi all day long.

Mike88 11-19-2018 6:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fixable (Post 1982446)
That said, you throw another 2k pounds in that boat, and it kicks an awesome wave.

Yep thats exactly what Ive done with my 210. Take the pro ballast option and swap those fatsac with 2x 750ís.
Piggy bank a 500 sumo sac bow bag under front seat that fills maybe 300lbs and its just awesome. Simple mods and give an assomme wave.
When i surfstyle on the port side i put some Lead bag on the port side or more people on this side.

Sure its not a ri217 wave or a Z3 wave. But man it really make the job with these simple mods.
Ive ridden lots of boat and not much 21footer can compete with that wave. Stictly no one under 4,500 pounds dry Weight too.


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