John we are not arguing. I'm just stating my opinion. I don't have a link or some graph to back up my opinion, and even if I did who cares.
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I seriously doubt half of America was all that impressed that he said he wouldn't accept the paycheck.
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It is amusing, those that railed against President Obama and a flight to Hawaii and costs to the public, but overlook something like this. If the roles were reversed, it would be bedlam.
Funny how stuff only matters, if it's not your political party. Going to be a fun 4 years. |
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I'd like to ask some of those who said Obama didn't have enough political experience about what they think in regards to Trump's having zero political experience. It is going to be an interesting 4 years. |
I recall the grip was he had noting but political experience and no actual work experience other than being a community organizer.
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Trump has to move along multi million dollar projects (if not billion dollar projects). He has thousands of employees around the country and the world. You think running companies and building projects don't have a very large interaction with politicians and dealing with regulations/ paperwork? Historically our presidents come from some sort of executive experience. The Obama and McCain race meant for the first time we were gong to have a president without some sort of executive experience. Obama never ran anything. Never had employees. Only had 1.5 years in congress where he voted present every time to avoid a voting record. Before that he was a communist organizer. They are not even in the same ball park for experience. |
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If you "peaceful tolerant" democrats would quit sending death threats to his family and to the electors, we would not have to have this. |
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I would also like to see why it would cost $1MM a day for SS for the new first lady. That itself seems ridiculous.
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OK yeah, I agree... $365M a year just for first lady? Seems high by at least a factor of 10, probably 100.
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Image for a second that Hillary won the electoral college but lost the popular vote by 2 million people. How much damage would the right be causing. She was getting death threats just for running. Trump called the electoral college a joke that was rigging the election. |
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So are you saying that because the election did not go the way you wanted and you feel that you out voted Trump that you are justified in threatening the new President or that it is OK they do so? That is where I hear when you try and play the deflection game. If you want to go on about the electoral college, it is the most genius of systems. Why would a country want to be dictated policy by 3 small mass populated echo chambers? The college is right on. If you want want to win the election, quit piling up in a small area. Also, what about the 40% of the people that voted Republican in California. The democrats get to take advantage of all that population and simply put those chips on the democrat ticket. It also provides voter suppression against Republicans in the state because many times the election is over before I would even get off work to vote. |
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IOW in simpler terms..... He's refuting your notion that it's a right vs left thing. |
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My thought would be sure, those absentee ballots might not matter for president or congress or whatever, but could be absolutely critical for dog catcher or county commissioner or some other local ballot question. I'd be really surprised if the ballots really aren't being counted. But ICBW and I'm open to you showing me the error of my ways, Delta. |
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Some of the Dons good work recognised at last
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If knew the actual history of the college it gets very hard to defend. But given that you don't believe the parties flipped platforms, I don't expect you understand there is a history that was outdated years ago. Not to mention that every other modern country has far more effective election process that is run on popular vote only. All of which rank higher on the Democracy Index than the United States. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy_Index |
Lucky Trump graciously refused his 400k salary a year, he charged the secret service 1.6m for flying around in his plane protecting him
http://www.thefiscaltimes.com/2016/1...Campaign-Trail |
Recount! Oh the irony. One one hand, Hilderbeast derides the Don for not accepting the result before the vote, now gets behind a recount in order to flip the result. On the other hand if those naughty ruskys have hacked the voting machines and padded the result for the Don I think I would wet my pants in hysterical laughter.
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If anyone thinks conservatives would be acting like the world ended causing riots and inhibiting on people people's rights you're high.
Case in point last two elections. Tell me where all the protests and riots where ? You think there would be any a 3rd time? It's called acting like a grown up. The left doesn't know what that means tho. The media controlled the entire pre polling. They didn't just miss it. The completely fabricated everything with a left slant. |
Trump says millions in fraudulent votes were cast, that he actually won the popular vote. There's a recount, and the right makes everyone out to be a villain. Excuse me.... your own leader even says there was fraud. Was there actual voter fraud and you want to get to the bottom of it, or is Trump just full of ****? Its most likely that since the recount didn't not come from within your party, that it must be wrong.
It's comical how the right doesn't see the irony in their rhetoric. Personally, I don't think the recount could change the outcome of the election. It seems the only ones who think that it could are the crazies, and the right. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...llary-clinton/ |
On a different note, 11 cops shot and killed by white men in the past two weeks, and the Blue Lives Matter movement is silent. Where is the media coverage?
It's pretty obvious that the Blue Lives Matter isn't for the protection of cops, but only an opposition to Black Lives Matter. |
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Where has black lives matter been here in Chicago while record paces of over 700 murders and 3300 shootings have occurred. 92% black on black in homicides and 87% in shooting. Oh they're marching in downtown because an armed black teen w multiple front convictions was shot and killed by police while he was shooting another Gangbanger. Any group whose poster boys are convicted femurs who attempted to kill police is not a movement. It's a hate group. The bigger slap in the face is these families of the biggest dredges in society were paraded in front of the cameras at the White House for votes. Crying over their piece of garbage children who contributed nothing to society but violence. Come into the real life of big city politics where the constantly the draw districts and vote early and often. Don't require I'd , and allow same day registration to anyone . Hate to tell you but Trump (if he even made the statement ) is correct . Our country has failed when proper I'd isn't a requirement for votes. |
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A year in jail or loss of citizenship for burning the flag huh. Does he not understand how freedom of speech works?
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He doesn't have a clue. Gonna be a long four years of President Crybaby.
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"However, despite the Supreme Court’s pronouncements on the issue, seeking to criminalize flag burning has been a regular occurance in American politics, and was pushed in 2005 by Trumps’ Democratic presidential rival and former New York Sen. Hillary Clinton.
In 2005, Clinton co-sponsored the Flag Protection Act which, while it did not call for the stripping of citizenship, made flag burning punishable by a year in jail and a $100,000 fine." |
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For starters, we are not a democracy so there is that. We are a representative republic. The electoral college keeps are you big city in breeders from taking over the country. It is the same rational that the Senate gets two representatives from each state. It is not outdated, it is spot on. What is outdated is the winner take all from a state. 40% of Californians voted Republican yet the democrats get to take those large number of votes and put them in the D column. Just love liberal maps. Always pulling out the maps that show how much better things are in countries that are pretty much made up of all white people. Should we revisit the first point about parties flipping? |
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Also, I don't think he broadcast it as much as simply saying he would not take it. The term broadcast is a label by the receiver. I saw it as a simple statement. no more, no less. |
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Trump supporters --
I'm wondering how you feel about how the swamp is being drained thus far? Seems like lots of Washington insiders, billionaires, and wall street insiders. In other words business as usual? |
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I wanted a general policy direction that was different than trending environmental fascism and spread the US wealth to the third world. After that, the details get filled in real time. |
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Personally I think we are terrible custodians of the planet, moving away from "environmentalism" is moving in the wrong direction IMO but super interested to hear your view because in my circles there pretty much consensus that we can and should do much more. |
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Environmentalism is a religion/ control mechanism. It has went far away from the conservation movement in which I am a fan. No sense hunting animals until they are extinct just for the thrill of it. Environmentalism is nothing more than a tax scheme at this time. For instance, we in the US and especially California have tight tolerances for pollution controls. We also have high usage of oil (especially California). So who is actually polluting? Usage does not equate to pollution when you have serious controls on it. So at the end of the day, what is really the argument? If it is pollution, then you should be going after India, Russia and China. If it is strictly usage. Tough. Oil is sold on the world market. Buy it or drill for your own. There is no shortage at this time and not for anytime in the near future. At the end of the day, the earth has survived meteor strikes. I am sure a neutron burst or two. Mass floods, droughts. Take a look at the CO2 records from when the dinosaurs were on the earth. From what I understand and read, the CO2 was 10,000 times higher than now. How do environmentalists categorize the natural beauty of the earth back then? I am sure they think highly of it. If you subscribe to Darwin, then we are not long for this world anyway. We should evolve into a different form right? If you subscribe to religion, we are not long for the world either. The chunk of land people are so worried about will survive just fine. You know when a movement has jumped the shark? When people are trying to monetize it. Environmentalism is highly monetized now. |
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Delta, you have a great way of gathering, discerning and distributing the thoughts that most of us already think. I appreciate that. As for the libs on this thread, they have clearly been "gotten to" by the liberal media and seem to reading out of its play book at just about every turn. You can almost predict the next thing out of their mouths every time. Thank you for patiently taking the time to thoughtfully articulate the truth in ways the rest of us can't.
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That was a little harsh, i apologize. My point is it is intellectually lazy to label any idea you don't agree with as liberal and write it off with no analysis or explanation
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I've yet to see you win a single argument on this thread so what does that make your words worth?
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The people on here are fine people. I have boated with a few of them in the past (Now I am too old, fat, lazy and broke for it haha). All great people. The thing we don't understand is the written word is so impersonal and matter of fact. On a board like this, you would think we would break into a knife fight if we met. Further from the truth (except for John, he may knife someone only because he is really old and can afford to throw away his remaining life). Chat rooms are not a communication style we grew up with so the medium is trying. I get triggered sometimes as do others but it is all good. Ideas and communication make the world go round. Enjoy our disfunctional little family here. |
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I agree. Don't throw trash out the window, don't kill everything that walks for the sake of killing it. If you hunt it, use it. Some animals need to be culled or they will simply starve or destroy things (pigs). So I get it and would loved to been able to hunt and so on growing up. I do like to be able to see across the valley's when I drive so I get that too. What people are not seeing is things like the carbon tax in California and proposed for all the US. It is just a free money give away to wealth land owners to be able to collect indirect taxes from the working class. On the global scale, it is a continuation of the lefts attempt at globalism and UN control. It allows for indirect taxes of US citizens to share to the world in the name of a fake religion. I absolutely want that rolled back. I want California's Air Research Board rolled back. I don't need an unelected board making monetary police decisions on us. |
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There are bonified religions on this planet. They have lasted over a thousand years and are recognized as a religion. You can argue about the existence of a deity if you want, however the religion still remains. Then you have people who don't realize they are in a religion so I guess the term fake religion may not be the term. Cult maybe? |
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It is a religion started by the Angel of Light which in the bible is pretty clear as satan. People have to make up their own mind. I don't believe in ritual and isolationism regardless of the religion. |
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Ever hear the story of the $800 hammer or toilet seat? It is not that the hammer or toilet seat is anymore special by design. It is the testing, tracking, and other certifications that go along with it to meet a special specification from the military that says it makes the grade. You can go buy the same hammer or toilet seat for $30. That is what many of these regulations have done to our businesses. You should try and generate hazardous waste sometime. Actually as a private person, you generate a ton of hazardous waste that you do not realize you are generating. As a business or government agency, you would be fined and possibly ran out of business. Ever put rubbing alcohol on a cotton swab? hazardous waste depending on how you handle it. If it is wet, it is hazardous waste. If it dries, it is not. You are not allowed to let it air dry as a means to make it not waste. If you are using alcohol, you have to track how much you are using in a year to meet the requirements of the Air Research Board. You have to have people that understand the requirements for reporting and make sure you have records. Batteries? Yep. Did you now methanol has a separate federal and state requirement for transportation? The list is huge and the stakes are higher and more expensive as you go up in volume. These are also fairly easy items. Are you competing against businesses that do not have to track such trivial items and report out on them? Considering labor is the biggest cost to a business, you can easily add a million dollars a year to your budget to have the experts on hand to deal with these things. |
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Thing is, we have to compete with in the global economy. We are way ahead of the world in environmental protection so why does the world want to keep beating on America's door? Agenda, that's why. Most of these countries calling for our head live in rat infested sewage. They don't give two craps about the environment. They want the revenue and control from a environmental treaty. If people where really serious about the environment, they would be all over those countries. I guess their pockets are not deep enough. |
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Ooooo, i got a good idea, let's create a diplomatic incident with China so i can build a cheap resort in Taiwan. It will be yuge and tremendous.
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Ralph, are you or have you ever been a citizen of the USA? Sorry if this has been covered before.
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You should know that the US is in the top for CO2 - http://cdiac.ornl.gov/trends/emis/tre_tp20.html Also, Volcano CO2 accounts for something like 1% of the CO2. Human activity dwarfs it. Quote:
The reason the environmental movement has monetized the environment is because that is the only thing that matters for majority of business, so that is how it has been done in order to actually make a difference. Trump and his far right buddies hate the environmental movement that started in the 60s that want to unwind that. Just read some of what his current crew have said in the past. The only reason the environment has any protection in the US is because of the movement. If we get rid of the EPA or take away most its power you will have no protection from big companies polluting. Have you ever met people that have been victims of pollution? If not just look at the studies that show how terrible pollution and chemicals have been on children in the womb,and how many adult diseases can relate back to that. I love the environment, but I also like business. I am an entrepreneur and so are many of my friends. I have watched them create successful businesses while protecting and cherishing the environment. When I hear the belly aching about regulation, it just makes me roll my eyes as there is always competitor out there not belly aching and whining, but doing just fine (it just takes creativity, innovation, and hard work). I like to read opposing view points, but many of your posts are just another product of the anti-science and anti-fact BS that the extreme right represents. The US needs to get back to centrists (Republicans and Democrats) who use logic and facts to get things done. |
"Considering labor is the biggest cost to a business" depends on the business
The cost of labor at a fast food restaurant is 25%, many profitable businesses keep their labor cost under 30%, that's probably why they are successful, so most of their cost of the business is other than labor! Many businesses operate on margins of 2 or 3% margins for profit, so it is very important for their labor to be productive, which I cannot believe how they can be productive when they are on their phone's half the time! Maybe labor is Not as costly as you thought it was, but its still a major cost to an employer. Anyways, the federal government sucks! The State government is Ok, and the local or county government is awesome, because you know exactly where every penny goes in a local government, except if you live in Polk county, which really sucks! |
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We have always had extreme weather. You talking about falling for a scam. Even environmentalists have morphed the argument from Man Made to simply weather change. You did not answer the question about the CO2 being higher millions of years ago. Why do the ice core records state that it was much higher? Why was the earth lush and green at that time? (plant food maybe?). Look at records of human existence. The worst times for human existence was during the mini ice age. Disease and famine. Northern ice decreasing (which is has in the past) and southern ice increasing as stated by NASA if I recall. Regarding the EPA. The EPA does not make law and many times they are used political agendas. Laws are on the books already and no one is suggesting the EPA be completely dismantled. Much of their agenda is to tie down companies in paperwork to try and drive them out of the country. Have I met a victim of pollution. Actually I have. I went out to dinner last month with a lady who as part of the Aron Brokovich (sp?) story. She has had many many surgeries and it was horrible all around. She is one cool lady though. I do believe the EPA has a place, but not a political place. With that case, I can point to the mining water that was dumped into the river. Not a single person in trouble for that because it was a EPA team that did it. In the early 90's a worker on a backhoe punctured a oil line dumping 1000 or so gallons of oil into the water and the supervisor who was not even there got 6 months in prison. Go figure. Here is the deal. Most organizations like the EPA start out with a good heart and the best intentions. As they go along in time, they start coming up with non-sense to keep a budget. Like many of these non profit groups. Once someone starts collecting a check, they eventually become more and more radicalized in order to find someone who wants to give them a budget. It moves from the cause to keeping a job. That is what much of the environmentalism is about. Ask the guys who were busted making up the temperature data and tried to hide it. |
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There was no made up temperature data. http://www.factcheck.org/2015/02/not...perature-data/ What environmentalist has "morphed to weather change"? Not Scientists that are actually researching it. Also the EPA makes regulations which for all purposes are laws. We do agree that bureaucracy is self feeding and tends to grow. But that doesn't mean that the EPA should have its legs cut off. At this point with 99% of all the scientist who have looked into Climate change enough to have an opinion worth considering agreeing that Climate Change is real and is a problem, not believing in it, makes asking if you believe in gravity a legitimate question. |
[QUOTE=deltahoosier;1949804You did not answer the question about the CO2 being higher millions of years ago. Why do the ice core records state that it was much higher?[/QUOTE]
The peak at 7000ppm 500 million years ago was a result of a comet impact. Currently we are at 400ppm, the highest for 400,000 years. If you are suggesting that Trump is ok since a comet impact is worse then i have to agree. |
I guess what surprises me is the effects of climate change have already started, but people still say its a hoax
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/04/sc...ady-begun.html A friend in Miami Beach owns a water front condo. The building had to install basement pumps because it would flood at least once a week. |
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